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$115 against aggro

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01-05-2010 , 09:59 AM

WhoSaidFold

centurion

Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 155

When few hands earlier he 3bets A5, then cbets 480 to 300 on board Q5Q and ch/calls shove on 9 turn.. I had Q. Then he shoved few hands, got double-up and now this. Very donkish aggro.

Poker Stars $110+$5 No Limit Hold'em Tournament - t25/t50 Blinds - 2 players - View hand 457370
The Official DeucesCracked.com Hand History Converter

BTN/SB: t850 M = 11.33
Hero (BB): t2150 M = 28.67

Pre Flop: (t75) Hero is BB with 4

BTN/SB raises to t100, Hero calls t50

Flop: (t200) 6

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN/SB checks

Turn: (t200) 6

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN/SB bets t750 all in, Hero ???

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01-05-2010 , 10:01 AM

ImmortalTechnique

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 1,362

Fold and keep your 2:1

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01-05-2010 , 11:20 AM

_red_dog

grinder

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 495

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImmortalTechnique

Fold and keep your 2:1

/thread

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01-05-2010 , 11:23 AM

dwusbu

adept

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 973

jam pre.

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01-05-2010 , 11:38 AM

ImmortalTechnique

old hand

Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 1,362

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwusbu

jam pre.

Even better.

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01-05-2010 , 12:07 PM

JSpazz

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 6,694

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwusbu

jam pre.

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01-05-2010 , 12:40 PM

Fydor_8

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 573

Quote:

Originally Posted by dwusbu

jam pre.

This.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImmortalTechnique

Fold and keep your 2:1

But as played, this.

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01-05-2010 , 05:36 PM

bluemage55

veteran

Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 2,443

Jamming pre- is best if villain is as aggro pre- as they are post.

As played, villain's flop check behind range is important IMO. Given that villain is very aggro, they should have c-bet most hands that actually hit the flop and the turn didn't change anything. If we're fairly certain that villain usually c-bets flopped pairs, then we can call this.

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01-05-2010 , 05:45 PM

mersenneary

Food = Love

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 12,187

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImmortalTechnique

Fold and keep your 2:1

not a reason

and yes, easy shove pre, A4s does well.

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01-05-2010 , 06:09 PM

#10

suic!deking

adept

Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 1,136

If your history hand is the only other time you've seen him over bet... I call

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01-05-2010 , 09:15 PM

#11

Fydor_8

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 573

Quote:

Originally Posted by ImmortalTechnique

Fold and keep your 2:1

To elaborate, we're not just folding solely because we want to conserve our 2:1 chip advantage. We're basically folding because our hand only really beats a bluff in this spot. Yes, it may be possible that our opponent is bluffing, but we do not want to put ourself in a situation where we have to call off 750 chips in a spot where we're either way behind or a little ahead. For this reason, we can simply fold and only lose 100 chips and conserve our chip advantage, rather than taking this risk and calling, even though we may be ahead and might be folding the "best hand".

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01-05-2010 , 09:21 PM

#12

mersenneary

Food = Love

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 12,187

To be clear, our chip advantage is irrelevant, and the decision is the same if the chip stacks are reversed.

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01-05-2010 , 09:59 PM

#13

Punch Dancer

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 4,694

I don't mind a call here. He's repping a 6 that doesn't want value or a K is thrilled about the board pairing, and still doesn't want value. Timing/history would play in though. I think you see A high ALOT here.

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01-06-2010 , 01:37 PM

#14

Fydor_8

grinder

Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 573

Quote:

Originally Posted by mersenneary

To be clear, our chip advantage is irrelevant, and the decision is the same if the chip stacks are reversed.

This too. Thanks for filling in all the gaps for me Mers!

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01-06-2010 , 05:13 PM

#15

derosnec

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 14,294

Quote:

Originally Posted by mersenneary

To be clear, our chip advantage is irrelevant, and the decision is the same if the chip stacks are reversed.

i've noticed the chip advantage is often relevant psychologically. often opponents will spaz out and play even worse when they have fewer chips because they probably panic and feel the need to get chips back quickly. the opposite happens often when chip advantages are reversed: when they win a pot and outchip me 2:1, they play prevent defense and bleed off small pots to me as they try to avoid big pots and preserve their stack.

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01-06-2010 , 05:16 PM

#16

mersenneary

Food = Love

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 12,187

Quote:

Originally Posted by derosnec

i've noticed the chip advantage is often relevant psychologically. often opponents will spaz out and play even worse when they have fewer chips because they probably panic and feel the need to get chips back quickly. the opposite happens too very often: when they win a pot and outchip me 2:1, they play prevent defense and bleed off small pots to me as they try to avoid big pots and preserve their stack.

while there are likely small differences here, readless, it is silly to make much of it in calculation.

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01-06-2010 , 05:22 PM

#17

derosnec

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 14,294

yeah i'm not going to fold a hand on the turn because of chip advantage. just talking in general about chip advantage, cuz i see it often mentioned that it doesn't matter. a slight digression on my part.

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01-06-2010 , 05:23 PM

#18

mersenneary

Food = Love

Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 12,187

taking it into account is almost always going to be an error unless you have a specific read about the player's tendencies.

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