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11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? 11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision?

07-14-2008 , 01:35 AM
The hand under question happened directly after this hand below.

Full Tilt Poker, $11 + $0.50 NL Hold'em Sit n' Go, 50/100 Blinds, 2 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

Hero (BB): 1,125
SB: 1,875

Pre-Flop: (150) 3 2 dealt to Hero (BB)
SB calls 50, Hero checks

Flop: (200) 5 A K (2 Players)
Hero checks, SB bets 100, Hero raises to 300, SB calls 200

Turn: (800) 4 (2 Players)
Hero checks, SB checks

River: (800) 6 (2 Players)
Hero bets 400, SB calls 400

Results: 1,600 Pot
Hero showed 3 2 (a straight, Six high) and WON 1,600 (+800 NET)
SB mucked T T (a pair of Tens) and LOST (-800 NET)

Here is the hand


Full Tilt Poker, $11 + $0.50 NL Hold'em Sit n' Go, 60/120 Blinds, 2 Players
LeggoPoker.com - Hand History Converter

Hero (SB): 1,925
BB: 1,075

Pre-Flop: (180) 4 A dealt to Hero (SB)
Hero raises to 360, BB raises to 1,075 and is All-In, Hero ???

Villian had been known to shove and 3bet fairly frequently.

Is this a fold or call?
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 02:02 AM
1st hand - Why on earth would you c/r that flop? This is not a place you want to be bluffing. You have no reason to think villain will fold his hand - especially in an $11 buy in.

2nd hand - Call, but you should've shoved in the first place. With less than 10 bb's your only moves are shove or fold because any raise pot commits you.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 02:07 AM
1st Hand: typ 11 sng donk fest one c/r with a gutter and the other calling with unders. Not sure I like neither to be honest.

2nd hand: If your gonna bet into 1/3 of his stack you better have a hand thats worth calling the whole thing. I call and hope he is shoving any broadway unders or worse. I would have just called with A4 and seen flop, not a hand you want to get too involved with imo.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 03:07 AM
Yeah hand 1 is so awful - limping with 10 10, the c/r mistimed, and then the 10-10 calling this. Villain must have single-digit IQ to make that river call.

A4os - I would hate to double her/him up with this, and given how bad they played on hand 1, you could do better. But if they're shoving a lot, then probably ok.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 04:42 PM
"Loc: my style is impetuous" that is the only reasonable explanation for Hand 1

Hand 2: good advice has already been given
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 04:52 PM
I dont see the problem with raising that flop. I'd play hand one similar but I would lead the flop and bet turn. I think you played the hand fine. As for hand two it's a very easy call but i dont think you should be 3x it with these blinds and stacks.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 05:44 PM
hand 1 can be good imo depending on reads. If he is taking a lot of stabs in small pots this is the perfect spot for you to play back: scary board (not that it hit your range that hard, its rather a kind of irrational fear of As and Ks that I experience a lot), you have very little equity (bluffing the bottom of your range ftw), and some implied odds. You are not commiting yourself which is good also. Hand 2 is a shove/fold situation and with less than 10BBs its a very EZ shove. As played you are obviously committed, and you must call.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 05:50 PM
I've changed my stance on hand 1. You'd think villain cant continue with much on the flop in the first hand but he calls with 10s. You've been playing for a while as blinds are 50/100, so you should know he probably isnt folding anything. I still like this move against most players though.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 06:19 PM
Hand 2: Push all day long. Don't limp, don't min raise. Push.

If he is loose, he is calling with worse.
If he is tight, you are taking down the substantial blinds a good amount of the time.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Super Acct
Hand 2: Push all day long. Don't limp, don't min raise. Push.

If he is loose, he is calling with worse.
If he is tight, you are taking down the substantial blinds a good amount of the time.
This is ******ed advice and should be ignored.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:27 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Godlike
This is ******ed advice and should be ignored.
Shoving preflop is the best option at this blind level. Is that what you're disputing?

OP: way to get an low-level ripoff of my sweet-ass blanka avatar.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sejje
Shoving preflop is the best option at this blind level. Is that what you're disputing?

OP: way to get an low-level ripoff of my sweet-ass blanka avatar.
No you're right, I thought I was quoting someone elses post. Sorry.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:29 PM
which one? mine?
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by szamvan
which one? mine?
LOL no dude, it was from a intirely different forum. My bad for confusion.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:35 PM
Well, for the record, I don't hate hand 1.

Let's assume that OP has a reason for making the play at the pot (because it doesn't make sense otherwise).

For instance: what villain is limping Ax, Kx here? Not many. If he does, isn't he going to trap on this dry flop fairly often? (the guys limping Ax, Kx seem to me to be the same guys trapping here)

Also, maybe OP has a read about bet and/or sizing.

I think he was including it for mindset read (tilt IMO), and not to show what a jackass flop C/R he made just for the hell of it.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sejje
Well, for the record, I don't hate hand 1.

Let's assume that OP has a reason for making the play at the pot (because it doesn't make sense otherwise).

For instance: what villain is limping Ax, Kx here? Not many. If he does, isn't he going to trap on this dry flop fairly often? (the guys limping Ax, Kx seem to me to be the same guys trapping here)

Also, maybe OP has a read about bet and/or sizing.

I think he was including it for mindset read (tilt IMO), and not to show what a jackass flop C/R he made just for the hell of it.
I didnt hate hand 1 either until I saw the villain called with 10s, op must have some idea of if villain is a calling station or not by this point in the match. As I said, I like this move against most but it makes no sense bluffing someone who cant fold.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 08:57 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Godlike
I didnt hate hand 1 either until I saw the villain called with 10s, op must have some idea of if villain is a calling station or not by this point in the match. As I said, I like this move against most but it makes no sense bluffing someone who cant fold.
But Christ, assuming this villain doesn't limp Ax and Kx, how often does he have a pair here? He can probably muck most of his range. And maybe he bets 100%. We really don't know. What I'm saying is maybe it's a good play based on reads--and this time went wrong.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 11:28 PM
Hand 1: The guy called you down with third pair. When you have a calling station no need to check raise any draws.....Take him to value town with made hands..

Hand 2: I hate calling off with Ace "little". Usually a flip at best and more often than not in bad shape. As played I think you have to call here. Open shove Preflop. As weak as it may sounds I dont like calling 3 bets with deep stacks and A-little.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-14-2008 , 11:57 PM
I agree with hand 2 "shove" preflop.

As played it's super easy call bc you've committed so many chips.

Do a quick EV calc and mess with his ranges and you'll see how weak of a hand you HAVE to call with in order not to be losing more chips by folding. It should be pretty ridiculous.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-15-2008 , 01:28 AM
hand 2 is a standard shove preflop.

in hand 1 i play total different and fold everytime. That raise is really too expensive considering your stack. Anyway if you decide to raise i'm betting that turn almost everytime, i want to stack him when he has an ace or something good that called the flop. If i check the turn sometimes i try to checkraise the river because he's almost valuebetting/bluffing everything he called on the flop. Probably you took the maximum in this case but villain was really ******ed.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-15-2008 , 01:52 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sejje
Well, for the record, I don't hate hand 1.

Let's assume that OP has a reason for making the play at the pot (because it doesn't make sense otherwise).

For instance: what villain is limping Ax, Kx here? Not many. If he does, isn't he going to trap on this dry flop fairly often? (the guys limping Ax, Kx seem to me to be the same guys trapping here)

Also, maybe OP has a read about bet and/or sizing.

I think he was including it for mindset read (tilt IMO), and not to show what a jackass flop C/R he made just for the hell of it.
My reason for C/R the flop was that villian would raise every Ax and Kx type hands (would even show in some instances); moreover he was betting out when checked too plenty of the time.

So yea, that was my justification for hand 1; I should have explained it more thoroughly.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-15-2008 , 01:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by sejje
Shoving preflop is the best option at this blind level. Is that what you're disputing?

OP: way to get an low-level ripoff of my sweet-ass blanka avatar.
My Blanka used to be an animated gif that pwned yours. I changed it then decided to get it back now it wont work.

HU4ROLLZ?
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-15-2008 , 07:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ophidion
My Blanka used to be an animated gif that pwned yours. I changed it then decided to get it back now it wont work.

HU4ROLLZ?
Mine is straight out of the game, suckah. Can't beat that.

RPS 4 ROLLZ?
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote
07-15-2008 , 02:19 PM
Hand 1: I will c/r this flop too given your reads. I think FE is good. Metagame is good. You take control of flow of game and now he may be trying to adjust to yo instead of you adjusting to him. He may give you more free cards when you are oop. If I don't hit the gut, I check the rest of the streets and villain may check behind with better and see your poop which is good for metagame too imo. There are many good reasons that give merit to the c/r. I lead/ck turn depending on what I've been doing recently on turns and if villain is passive/callingstation. River fine. I bet 500 though.
11+1 SNG - Whats the correct decision? Quote

      
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