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0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush 0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush

08-27-2009 , 09:38 PM
Relevant Stats:
VPIP BB: 49
VPIP Button 67
PFR: 35
Fold to CBet: 20
Checkraise: 25

This guy hates folding. Moderately aggro, but moreso on the river.
He started off shortstacked. For history, here's the hand we stacked off on (not the hand in question).

Hero (SB) ($130.10)
BB ($61.20)

Preflop: Hero is SB with K, J
Hero bets $3, BB calls $2

Flop: ($6) 4, 10, J (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $4.25, BB calls $4.25

Turn: ($14.50) K (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $10, BB calls $10

River: ($34.50) 5 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $14, BB raises to $28, Hero raises to $112.85 (All-In), BB calls $15.95 (All-In)

Results:
Hero had K, J (two pair, Kings and Jacks).
BB had 9, Q (straight, King high).
Outcome: BB won $121.90

3betting the river is a bit thin, but I think there's definitely some value since i've seen him show up with hands like K4, K5, JT, KT, etc.



Anyway, onto the hand in question...
Hero (SB) ($104)
BB ($118.80)

Preflop: Hero is SB with 8, 7
Hero bets $3, BB calls $2

Flop: ($6) 10, Q, 9 (2 players)
BB bets $3, Hero calls $3

Turn: ($12) 6 (2 players)
BB bets $8, Hero raises to $28, BB calls $20

River: ($68) 9 (2 players)
BB bets $50, Hero folds

Last edited by Gugel; 08-27-2009 at 09:47 PM.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-27-2009 , 11:00 PM
comeon you guys, it's been an hour and a half.

0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-27-2009 , 11:05 PM
Jesus... I think I still call. It's dynamic dependent but usually in my matches people are still vbetting Q's here

Also... I really don't like folding when I have a decent hand and the best barreling card for my opponent rolls off.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 01:01 AM
call... he might be trying to valuebet worse hands and you have a super strong hand as well.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 01:08 AM
Yeah it's gross but against described opponent I usually call in these spots, especially given that naked J and spades missed and he could conceivably have both. Really close though especially given betsizing.

Also river 3bet in the example is standard and not at all thin imo. Minraise is usually the kiss of death in these spots but there are so many worse hands in his value range (like you mentioned). I also hate your river betsizing in that hand.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 01:31 AM
you didn't get us much info about his donkbetting so i honestly dont know what to do
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 01:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barewire
you didn't get us much info about his donkbetting so i honestly dont know what to do
Yeah but this is a pretty unique spot, I don't think he's going to be able to tell us much and it's not like we can take his flop donkbetting habits and apply them here.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 01:56 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by rbracco
Yeah but this is a pretty unique spot, I don't think he's going to be able to tell us much and it's not like we can take his flop donkbetting habits and apply them here.
it would tell us if 2pair is even part of his flop range (i have a feeling it isn't, but gugel probably knows better than us). also he should know how likely flush draws even are here, and the more i type here the more this seems like an easy call unless he has reads to prove me wrong.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 06:22 AM
Why can't he have combos of 9's with straight draws or combo spade draws with gutters etc?

Or

Do these combos not matter in this spot?
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 06:36 AM
imo this is a fold.also, on hand #1, if he hates fold, why you bet so small on river?
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 07:38 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by urubu111
imo this is a fold.also, on hand #1, if he hates fold, why you bet so small on river?
In hand 1, I was betting the maximum I thought Tx was gonna call on the river.

Last edited by Gugel; 08-28-2009 at 07:51 AM.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-28-2009 , 07:54 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Barewire
it would tell us if 2pair is even part of his flop range (i have a feeling it isn't, but gugel probably knows better than us). also he should know how likely flush draws even are here, and the more i type here the more this seems like an easy call unless he has reads to prove me wrong.
No real reads on his donkbets. He did it a few times, but it didn't get to showdown. Donkbetting like 15% of flops if that helps.
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote
08-29-2009 , 06:55 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gugel
In hand 1, I was betting the maximum I thought Tx was gonna call on the river.
imo betting bigger smells like a bluff and Tx will call lighter. betting small smells like a value bet and Tx sometimes can find a fold.

def bet bigger!
0NL - I Have a Straight on Turn, River Pairs Board and Brings Flush Quote

      
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