thx for the advice. I think the owning thing is pretty key. I'm pretty much fine most of the time but the 'ownership' factor makes me call way too much in 3 bet pots, i think. I've been thinking abt it a lot, and playing around with stoxEV without ever coming to a decent counter-strategy, but i guess at 50NL, less fancy>more fancy and swallowing the ego and playing a range pretty much just for value is the starting point.

Yeah, it's interesting, wilt on tilt has an article on DC where he says 3 betting is overrated because people react to it well enough now. That's just not true at 50NL, afaics.

lol at people at 50NL reacting well enough to anything

a) avoid sitting to the right of regs (best 3bet strategy ever)
b) If you're gonna make a stand try do it in position with a hand that has equity
c) I almost never 4bet bluff, I've found that I have more success floating.

The only times I really "defend" against a light 3bet are if i'm OTB and they're in the blinds, if I"m CO and he's btn (to which case I might check/shove lightly, but this can get fairly spewy), or defending against squeezes (ie I raise, call, sb squeezes, I'll shove 99 or whatever)

For the most part I say just lay your hand down pf and move on

500 50 DONs in the books, -$100 (or +185ish after FPP value). I feel like I have been running like dog ****, but who knows if that is subjective. Lots of things like AK < A9 or AQ = A3 type stuff. One time, I clicked to another window thinking I had the mortal nuts (we were all in) where I missed he had a back door perfect perfect straight possibility, like he had 96 on a 5 K Q board with me having KK. I don't remember the hand beyond me having top set and him having nothing, all I remember is I had a set bigger than his highest card with no straight or flush draws up and two cards to come. I think the play was a lot better in general in these than at the 20's. I think I am going to do 500 $27 turbos, and maybe some 2 and 3 table SNG's after that if if looks like I can get volume.

One thing I want to make sure of is that I have a decent SNG game in case stars gives all the promo love to them again this year.

Edit - already hit my first feaux pas as I go in some 38's by mistake. So much for uniform data.

I have successfully 4-bet bluffed twice in the last 600 hands at FTP 25nl (out of 2 tries). I didn't actually expect to be doing so but in both cases it was pretty obviously a good move. It seems like pre-flop aggression is slowly moving down the stakes. Which isn't to say that the 25nl players are good, but the memes are spreading anyway.

godmode continues:

win JJ > AK vs shorty, 77 > 66 vs shorty, and AK > AQ vs a shorty with tons of dead money in the pot. Some guy spews off half a stack with K8 on JJ8 and I snap him off with 99. Then top it off with KK > 86 on 875 flop for half a stack and I'm up $840ish in like 120 hands.

Then I broke even for a little while before stopping for a meal. 1800 hands to go!

Poker Stars $3/$6 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (BTN): $912.65
SB: $503.20
BB: $619.05
UTG: $52.00
CO: $654.00

Pre Flop: ($9.00) Hero is BTN with K A
UTG calls $6, CO raises to $24, Hero calls $24, SB calls $21, 1 fold, UTG raises to $52 all in, CO raises to $108, Hero raises to $912.65 all in, 2 folds

Flop: ($298.00) 8 K 3 (2 players - 2 are all in)

Turn: ($298.00) 7 (2 players - 2 are all in)

River: ($298.00) T (2 players - 2 are all in)

Final Pot: $298.00
Hero shows K A (a pair of Kings)
UTG mucks Q A
Hero wins $112.00
Hero wins $184.00
(Rake: $2.00)

thoughts on this line? CO is an aggressive reg, plays high volume and is a big winner. Shortstack is probably a clown. I expect CO to be raising any hands with some sort of value and will fourbet his entire range with this action. If the limper shoves then I shove over the isolation fourbet, if the limper folds then I play out a pot in position with a deceptive hand (albeit, one with little nut potential).

edit to add: limper was definitely a clown, had already done smart stuff like limp-call with an $88 stack

I miss $200NL

I grinded $100NL for aaaaaaaaages - thenfinally moved up and stopped bing a nit and I remember thinkning.

wtf - this is the same as $100NL - why didn't I make the move a long time back???

That was over a year ago but back then the difference in skill was minimal. I know the games have changed since I got back to playing some more but I watch a lot of Leggo/Stox/etc vids at the midstakes levels and am usually about right with reading villains hands.

Soon I will be back at the cashaments - soon.

meh - 25NL/50NL is mostly TPTK+ mining with extras. I was the worlds worst at overplaying and trying out this or that fancy play cos I'd read in MSNL or watched it on a vid somewhere. TAG ABC pwns microstakes. For the most part when they bet they have it. you should pretty much never flat a 3bet OOP unless you are trapping with "the goods" and even then it's usually best to shove for value.

3betting isn't difficult to counter but you need a bundle of hands of data or some good reads, people at the micro stakes way overplay their hands and call too much with dominated holdings IME. 4betting people and watching them go into the tank cos they have no clue as to what to do next is always fun - as is flatting their 3bet in position and shoving any flop when they check it to you when AK has obv whiffed, you just got to pick the right kinds of villains to play back at.

Matrix,

Those 4.40 180 mans seem to be a great way to build a roll from nothing. I won 4 of those last month- not sure how many I played but my roi in them is something like 275%

The play in those is just absolutely atrocious. I want to start playing more of the $12 turbos since it seems like a crime to just be 1 tabling triple draw-- but I'm lazy.

4/180s are so soft it's ridiculous - none of my hands are holding though

on my last of a set of 12 today now - AA<KK QQ<T3o AK<K5s etc etc etc.

I am a persistant barsteward though and will keep grinding. This lol variance has got to turn around sometime. Still can't beleive my ROI in these playing against the kinds of player where you can open shove AA preflop and still get 2 calls at 15/30 blinds from AJo 55 etc.

The $12/180 turbos are waaaay more variance and filled with lots of good regs.

Poker Stars $2/$4 No Limit Hold'em - 7 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

UTG+1: $1020.80
MP: $400.00
CO: $400.00
BTN: $400.00
SB: $395.50
BB: $200.00
Hero (UTG): $434.15

Pre Flop: ($6.00) Hero is UTG with 5 5
Hero raises to $12, 1 fold, MP calls $12, CO calls $12, BTN calls $12, 2 folds

Flop: ($54.00) 5 A 5 (4 players)
Hero bets $38, MP folds, CO raises to $104, BTN folds, Hero calls $66

Turn: ($262.00) K (2 players)
Hero checks, CO checks

River: ($262.00) A (2 players)
Hero checks, CO bets $168, Hero raises to $318.15 all in, CO calls $116 all in

Final Pot: $830.00
CO mucks A Q
Hero shows 5 5 (four of a kind, Fives)
Hero wins $827.00
(Rake: $3.00)

godmode continues

decided to play a LIMIT donkament today to breakup the grind.

I is a total Limidonk.


Poker Stars $4.00+$0.40 Limit Hold'em Tournament - t150/t300 Limit - 9 players -

BTN: t3805 M = 16.91
Hero (SB): t2895 M = 12.87
BB: t2155 M = 9.58
UTG: t6133 M = 27.26
UTG+1: t2010 M = 8.93
UTG+2: t1832 M = 8.14
MP1: t4820 M = 21.42
MP2: t2975 M = 13.22
CO: t4935 M = 21.93

Pre Flop: (1.5 SB) Hero is SB with T T
6 folds, BTN raises, Hero 3-bets, 1 fold, BTN calls

Flop: (7 SB) 6 J 2 (2 players)
Hero bets, BTN calls

Turn: (4.5 BB) 4 (2 players)
Hero bets, BTN calls

River: (6.5 BB) 8 (2 players)
Hero bets, BTN calls

Final Pot: 8.5 BB
BTN mucks A K
Hero shows T T (a pair of Tens)
Hero wins 8.5 BB

Is that standard? - I thought no way do I win this pot when villain snap calls the river.

nh - you gotta love it when villain pot commits himself on the river when you flop quads.

maybe check and give him an opportunity to bluff?

I would think that if he is calling your hand is probably no good so I'd give him the chance to take a stab at it

Well it's not like villain is ever fold there :P

*** DEALING HANDS ***
Dealt to xDKG [9h 7h Ah 2h As]
InstantLei: folds
syntaxeror: folds
-Bay777-: raises $5 to $10
nasty60: folds
xDKG: calls $5
*** FIRST DRAW ***
xDKG: discards 3 cards [9h Ah As]
Dealt to xDKG [7h 2h] [Js Qd 3s]
-Bay777-: discards 2 cards
xDKG: checks
-Bay777-: bets $5
xDKG: calls $5
*** SECOND DRAW ***
xDKG: discards 2 cards [Js Qd]
Dealt to xDKG [7h 2h 3s] [8h 9d]
-Bay777-: discards 1 card
xDKG: checks
-Bay777-: bets $10
xDKG: raises $10 to $20
-Bay777-: raises $10 to $30
xDKG: calls $10
*** THIRD DRAW ***
xDKG: stands pat on [7h 2h 3s 8h 9d]
-Bay777-: discards 1 card
xDKG: checks
-Bay777-: checks
*** SHOW DOWN ***
xDKG: shows [8h 7h 9d 2h 3s] (Lo: 9,8,7,3,2)
-Bay777-: mucks hand
xDKG collected $90 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $92 | Rake $2
Seat 2: InstantLei folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 3: syntaxeror folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 4: -Bay777- (button) mucked [3h 7s 2d Ks 5h]
Seat 5: nasty60 (small blind) folded before the Draw
Seat 6: xDKG (big blind) showed [8h 7h 9d 2h 3s] and won ($90) with Lo: 9,8,7,3,2

my fun hand of the last little bit.

I'm totally comfortable in this game even though I'm a little underrolled for it, but it will be a while before I can take a shot at 10/20-- unless somebody wants a piece?

no, you don't want to start playing the 12/180s unless you get your thrills from 125 buy in downswongs

my YTD in them



looking at the sscopes for the "good" 12/180 grinders 40% is completely reasonable, i'm at 16% thus far

the play is lolbad but the variance is brutal

I think you played this right. I think one of the biggest mistakes that most people make in LHE is that they don't valuebet nearly light enough on scary boards - people always assume you're bluffing when you continue betting on a scarecard. When in doubt, valuebet!

so I was up $1400+ after not too many hands today, kept grinding and worked my way all the way back to $50. Took a break to eat and on my 2nd hand of the third session I coolered a guy with top set against ace high with an 8 kicker, all-in on the turn for about 85bb

obv I should keep all my sessions to just 20 minutes

*** DEALING HANDS ***
Dealt to xDKG [5h 2s 7s As 9s]
-Bay777-: folds
syntaxeror: folds
xDKG: raises $5 to $10
Oh ma hog: folds
flagler: folds
anomalocaris: raises $5 to $15
xDKG: calls $5
*** FIRST DRAW ***
anomalocaris: discards 1 card
xDKG: discards 2 cards [As 9s]
Dealt to xDKG [5h 2s 7s] [3h 3d]
anomalocaris: bets $5
xDKG: calls $5
*** SECOND DRAW ***
anomalocaris: discards 1 card
xDKG: discards 1 card [3d]
Dealt to xDKG [5h 2s 7s 3h] [Kd]
anomalocaris: bets $10
xDKG: calls $10
*** THIRD DRAW ***
anomalocaris: discards 1 card
xDKG: discards 1 card [Kd]
Dealt to xDKG [5h 2s 7s 3h] [Tc]
anomalocaris: checks
xDKG: bets $10
anomalocaris: calls $10
*** SHOW DOWN ***
xDKG: shows [5h 2s 7s 3h Tc] (Lo: T,7,5,3,2)
anomalocaris: shows [Qh 7c 2c 6d 3s] (Lo: Q,7,6,3,2)
xDKG collected $79 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot $82 | Rake $3
Seat 1: xDKG showed [5h 2s 7s 3h Tc] and won ($79) with Lo: T,7,5,3,2
Seat 2: Oh ma hog (button) folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 3: flagler (small blind) folded before the Draw
Seat 4: anomalocaris (big blind) showed [Qh 7c 2c 6d 3s] and lost with Lo: Q,7,6,3,2
Seat 5: -Bay777- folded before the Draw (didn't bet)
Seat 6: syntaxeror folded before the Draw (didn't bet)

anomalocaris: nice bet on the end
anomalocaris: clown

Was on pace and had the right mindset for it but I've had to call it quits after 1632 hands due to a headache that's getting worse. Third session saved the day and I netted $1100+ overall for 7 ptbb/100 so still running pretty good.

Same goal for tomorrow.

i don't know how many of you frequent BBV but there is an epic sit-n-go prop bet going on as we speak

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/54...op-bet-392492/

ah - on that river I thought I was bluffing.

well I've discovered why I was getting a headache around dinnertime yesterday and ended up feeling hungry and sick and went to bed early - it turns out I forgot to actually eat most of what I intended to eat for lunch.