you are objectively wrong and we are objectively right

on this issue at least

this game is actually an excellent primer for basic design theory and rules stuff

lots of really interesting object lessons of what not to do and why

was BMO in this game btw?

I agree that I'm an easy mislynch. And wolves know it. BU But it's my fault. Many big leaks.

You can tell when I'm a wolf easily. Am I not a top wagon? Then I'm a wolf and my teammates, while not necessarily protecting me, aren't influencing Town to lynch me.

God help us if I actually rand a useful PR.

I would really like to know the rationale, because I think it is an unnecessary gamble and a risk. This is in the scenario where it is a public mod peek.

I'll take partial blame for Batm...

Incidentally, I do not see any positive at all from BATM claiming wolf in this game.

One final thing, there was a notable amount of salt in DVC for this game. Occasionally, I do little remixes on my wrestling podcast feed. There is one that features ... Quite a lot of salt, and I have some hopes of it becoming an anthem for ww-related saltiness. See below:

https://soundcloud.com/jerryvonkrame...-but-pure-salt

when you were asking for a vanilla to step forward day 1 i thought there was a good chance you were a wolf and were reverse PR hunting. The fact that you were looking for someone else to step forward and not volunteering yourself made us think on day 2 (when we had WC) that you were a PR. Also during the whole peeking thing Roman said in ALL CAPS "dont peek me" so he was outted as a PR.

I understand what you are saying that it would be better not to peek a PR, but at that point on day 1 where your alignment is still a question to everyone else, it is hard to get people to step forward or trust what you are doing is actually pro village.

I think instead of finding a vanilla, you just modpeek a slanker who always has equity to be a wolf and if he's a villager you prevent a viable mislynch.

No targeting restrictions for 4 Angels could have been a good time if they all claimed and colluded

Let's leave out the 25% of the time a wolf gets peeked, which is obviously a huge win and really shouldn't be left out.

Let's also assume that you peek a random villager who may or may not be a PR, and it's an affiliation modpeek.

Briefly, your fallacies are:

1) peeking a PR is bad because wolves will now prioritize killing them. While this CAN happen, if you're peeking someone you should be peeking d1 (a not very good player who is wolfy sounding), that risk is mitigated because that's exactly the sort that is going to end up having to claim to save themselves anyway.

You also ignore the times when injecting a wolfy player into lock clear status presents the wolves with a set of unpalatable options.

2) by asking for volunteers to be peeked, you're just giving the wolves the information you're trying to avoid them getting in the first place!!!

The answer to Lord's query is simple.

Make the modpeek on someone you want to force the wolves to kill. Someone who is historically an underperforming villager or even a liability.

Then make the wolves waste KP on their scrub ass.

Who cares if they were a PR? They were gonna be a PITA anyway.

Lord I thought you were openly wolfing when you did that peek thing

Well, it's an affiliation peek

Putting aside the separate and material benefits of putting people on record as to who should be peeked and why, which often helps demonstrate who is genuinely trying to solve the game and who is merely pretending, here are the possible outcomes

1) Peek returns a result of wolf or neutral: obviously an awesome outcome for villa that doesn't happen under your scenario. There is no world in which a public wolf peek is not ++++EV for villa

2) Peek returns a result of villa: the person who has been peeked is now more of a nk priority for wolves (unless they're a godfather, tee hee), yes. That means that if they are a power role they are probably getting killed by the wolves slightly earlier than if they hadn't been peeked, but -- and this is important -- the same is true if they are vanilla, and there are generally plenty of vanillagers in the game. Not to mention that a peeked villager will be more likely to receive angel protection, which is to their benefit if they're a power role.

2a) More importantly, though, a peeked villager is much much MUCH less likely to ever get mislynched or misvigged by the villa; it puts them into the "solved" bucket so that nobody has to concentrate on them anymore. This is disproportionately beneficial if that player is a power role, because they'll never be forced to claim in order to avoid being lynched. And one side benefit of having a peeked villager is that the other villagers have someone to trust and rely on, which is why it's important if possible to peek someone who will be a village captain when getting clear. Having a clear person to lead things is crucial in combatting wolf efforts to control the thread.

Cliffs: information regarding someone's affiliation is much more valuable to the village than to the wolves, regardless if that person is a power role or a vanillager

I still contend peeking Redd is always correct in that spot. Imagine he peeks villager. What the hell is the wolf team supposed to do? So it is win win.

Obviously I didn't know he was going to 0 post 2 days and be subbed with a competent player D3. I actually think he should have been mod killed. Cause he was posting in the forum and ignoring this game, which means he is very likely to be villager. At least Copper wasn't around, so he can legitimately say he forgot about game or was too busy or whatever. In redds case his non playing basically spewed himself villager.

Okay, but let's say storm followed through with my plan of peeking the one person who stepped forward as the vanilla (I forget the player). Isn't forcing that kill more optimal than forcing a kill on a PR?

As it turned out, wolves or neutrals ended up killing that vanilla anyway, but my rationale was if that is what is going to happen, you might as well make it a vanilla.

Reading other responses now.

Basically, Lord, you kept talking about having a villa core

Peeking someone villa puts that person in EVERYONE'S villa core

That is a really good thing

That too.

You're just gleaning info for the wolves if you do that. Asking players to take a stance on whether they're vanilla or a PR? You can't see where that could go wrong?
Even someone trying to smoothly avoid discussing the topic can accidentally fumble and out themselves as a PR or not a PR with discussion like that flying around. Seers get caught by stuff like this... their reactions to people fake claiming, for example.

You very skillfully managed to get effectively two people peeked

That much is true

Kudos to Zorkman to stepping up immediately and minimizing collateral damage from your strategy

(You were asking for a vanillager to volunteer: what happens if all the active players in the thread at that point are power roles? You've just outed all of them!)

I prefer to peek wolves when I am a seer. But that is just me.

Me too

I made this exact argument to peek redd in the thread. And I was ignored and mislynches...

Actually, Monte agreed with me. Then he led my mislynch.

To be fair, storm did peek a wolf

Troll roles are fun though