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Folded kings full on the river Folded kings full on the river

01-10-2010 , 02:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Into2ndWind
you're an idiot though

when he checks behind turn AK/AA IS MAAAAAAAAAAAJORLY discounted.

LIKE.. he almost never has it.

people who bet the flop with top set don't check it back on this turn lol.

now if he checked back flop, called ur turn, and shoved river, that's different.

but when someone bets the flop and then checks back a blank turn, he almost never has AA/AK.

there's two types of players in the world at 100NL. ones who know they just wanna bet/bet/bet, and others who check back their monsters on flops. (maybe not exactly) Nobody bet/check/bets AK or AA on this board.

ok my point is... anyone who WOULD bet AA/AK on this flop WOULD bet it on the turn.

not to mention you bet 19i42 on the river, which is INDUCING. you induced this.

this is a snap call.
sweet, what do you put him on?
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01-10-2010 , 02:44 PM
^^^^^^^^

I was just going to say might as well started folding kings pre!!!!
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01-10-2010 , 02:46 PM
Since nobody here is going to give you a cookie, why don't you just tell us which streets you played horribly and we can move on. Either you played the Preflop through the River lead bet horribly, putting in 40% of effective stacks against the world's tightest player who could only be playing hands that beat you, or your laydown on the river was horrible. Let us know.
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 02:56 PM
well played, all around

Last edited by dwiele; 01-10-2010 at 02:56 PM. Reason: NOTTTTT
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 03:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by illdonk
Since nobody here is going to give you a cookie, why don't you just tell us which streets you played horribly and we can move on. Either you played the Preflop through the River lead bet horribly, putting in 40% of effective stacks against the world's tightest player who could only be playing hands that beat you, or your laydown on the river was horrible. Let us know.
I already let you know in the original post . The preflop call was bad. The river bet was to get a call from aq/aj.
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01-10-2010 , 03:13 PM
u cant limit someones range to two hands...AA and Ak!! QJs J10s KJ, KJs, sshould be in there, just a horible fold

Last edited by icracknuts; 01-10-2010 at 03:15 PM. Reason: along with qq
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 03:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by icracknuts
u cant limit someones range to two hands...AA and Ak!! QJs J10s KJ, KJs, sshould be in there, just a horible fold
yeah i don't know if you play small stakes full ring, but a 11/9 nit is never 3betting an utg raiser with qjs, kj, or kjs. and tjs has a royal flush.
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 03:21 PM
then try to bust him with middle suited connectors not kq
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01-10-2010 , 03:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by umistboy
[ X ] Got everything you deserve for calling his 3bet OOP with KQs - he has a 4% 3bet!!

The second he checks behind on the turn he doesn't have as big a hand as you clearly give him credit for.

[ ] fold
[ X ] call
inb4 Internet posts:

[ ] [ x ]
[x] [x]

Also, this is terrible, but if you think he has ak/aa why not just c/c the riv ?
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01-10-2010 , 03:25 PM
u put ur self in a spot where u must call, if u are going to play the hand u have be willing to lose with it/ folding is always ganna be -ev
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 03:27 PM
thought process?
wth is wrong with you..
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 03:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Angelo
11/9 full ring nit raising huge on the river... What % of the time would you say he has air here? If I had to put a number on it, I would say 1% of the time he has air there and I would venture that is an extremely generous estimation. Also what is your definition of air? Everything hit that board. The closest thing he could have to air in this situation is jj or tt, and he is never ever turning those into bluffs on the river. At least not a large enough portion of the time to even bother including them in any calculations. I think people are being truly dazzled by the kings full and are for some reason unable to apply basic hand reading skills to this hand.
totally agree.
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01-10-2010 , 03:40 PM
This is why i still suck at poker. I snap call and just say to myself 'cooler'
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 03:54 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Angelo
11/9 full ring nit raising huge on the river... What % of the time would you say he has air here? If I had to put a number on it, I would say 1% of the time he has air there and I would venture that is an extremely generous estimation.
You can't sum up a guy's game by quoting his preflop stats. They say very little about his postflop tendencies. Being super tight preflop doesn't mean he's not very very aggressive postflop and well capable of a bluff raise or thin raise on the river.

1% is a very very very very very small number. I'm not saying it's a high % but thinking he bluffs only 1% of the time gives him FAR too much credit.
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01-10-2010 , 04:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Xereles
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7F9dh4_vtN8
I just love it when pros debate folding kings full on the river.
This is awesome and very on-topic.
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01-10-2010 , 04:19 PM
Did you call yet?
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01-10-2010 , 04:22 PM
sick fold, its a tarp
Folded kings full on the river Quote
01-10-2010 , 05:04 PM
This fold is the exact opposite of a hero call.

Is there such a thing as a hero fold? Don't think i've ever heard that term.

The problem with hero folds like this (especially when 40% of your stack is committed) is that they are long term losers.

Lets say you play 100 hands that are exactly like this, and each hand is $100.

IMO, you win in this scenario 95% of the time which results in $9,500.

You lose 5 times which results in -$500 for a total of $9,000.

So what are the odds of you correctly identifying the 5% losers?

There is a 95% chance that you will fold one of the 'winning' hands and a 5% chance you will fold one of the losing hands.

So odds are that you are going to fold one of the winning hands but still lose one of the losing hands. So by trying to make these hero folds, you merely decrease your overall value since the odds are you are still going to be losing that 5% (make sense).

This is why, in these types of scenarios, it is better to just make the call.

And this is why, I love shoving against nits and mice. They scare themselves into folding because 'obviously' I have the 1 or 2 hands that can beat them
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01-10-2010 , 05:15 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CTH4KNiMyjU
Hero fold....... what a hero
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01-10-2010 , 05:18 PM
What else did you hope for with KQ?

But then yet again the guy on WSOP folded similar hand
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01-10-2010 , 05:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Angelo
Most of this thread is "omg you have kings full you can't fold" which is exactly why I made the thread. For shock value. But when you know you're beat, why call of another 60 bbs? I still think it was the 2nd best fold of my life.
Hahahahaha.
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01-10-2010 , 05:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Angelo

............

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is UTG with K Q
Hero raises to $3, 1 fold, CO raises to $9, 3 folds, Hero calls $6


............
This hand should not be in the preflop playbook when it comes to calling a three bet if you intend on investing $31 postflop but folding for another $60 on a board where you make Kings full.
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01-10-2010 , 05:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greg Angelo
Most of this thread is "omg you have kings full you can't fold" which is exactly why I made the thread. For shock value. But when you know you're beat, why call of another 60 bbs? I still think it was the 2nd best fold of my life.
There is nothing to suggest that you are beat here, it's not like you've cited previous history, or it's live play and there's some sick physical tell. If you're coolered, so be it, but you can't call the 3bet preflop, put $31 in postflop, and then fold on a board which is about as good as it's going to get for KQs for another $60.

If his range is so limited, why bother to lead the river? What's he calling with that you beat if you're convinced that he can only have an enormous preflop hand?

Sometimes people mix it up or step out of line preflop, his 3-bet % doesn't automatically mean he has to have AA etc.
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01-10-2010 , 05:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2OutsNoProb
There is nothing to suggest that you are beat here, it's not like you've cited previous history, or it's live playand there's some sick physical tell. If you're coolered, so be it, but you can't call the 3bet preflop, put $31 in postflop, and then fold on a board which is about as good as it's going to get for KQs for another $60.

If his range is so limited, why bother to lead the river? What's he calling with that you beat if you're convinced that he can only have an enormous preflop hand?

Sometimes people mix it up or step out of line preflop, his 3-bet % doesn't automatically mean he has to have AA etc.
read this op
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01-10-2010 , 05:52 PM
I've seen a lot of misplayed hands in my day but this is just on a new level
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