Ouch!

I don't understand what you're doing here.

You don't understand much about poker, judging by the state of your posts.

plo is a hell of a drug. if you startplaying it you wont go back to holdem.

btw. **** uuu manu

Definitely more addictive

Less folding, Bigger pots, bigger hands, way more action. It's not out of the ordinary to see 2-3 BI sized pots, potentially even more

The variance is a mother****er though

I stopped playing PLO the day I lost 4 buy ins in 15 minutes. That's $33,280,000 a year if I lost like that consistently. I was way ahead twice (and I mean in terms of Hold'em, to the likes of needing to fade one non-suit gutshots) and had a million out the other two times.

lol more flips bro?

I'm a long, long lurker. Actually, I've been reading all the forums in 2p2 for the past years, always trying to learn **** and LOL'ing. But this thread, which I read in its almost entirety, is amazing. It is an awesome read.

I, like most of you, am a huge degen. But unlike most of you guys, I only play poker. I never really understood, or cared for, roullete, baccarat, BJ, craps or things of the sort.
Started out as a winner (non degen) in NLHE, and started playing PLO because of a huge bad run. I'll share some stories when I have the time. But really, this thread is really helping me to understand lots of unresolved **** for me.

Cheers

Welcome.

I'm like you, I only play poker. Occasionally degening at it.

It's nice coming here after losing cheeseburger money's at the micros and reading about how someone's just lost 5k at BJ and roulette etc

Been taking shots at some of the 'high' stakes Mtts on stars over the past few days ($109s, $80 turbo) and dropped about $500 since Monday, which for me, someone who exclusively played 3.5$ sngs is pretty gross

Had 20bbs close to bubble, get QJs in the BB. Folds to btn who min raises and SB flats. SqueeZe all in, btn folds and after a long tank the SB called me with 23s and I'm drawing dead otf

Another mtt I find myself pretty short stacked, move in from the btn with A9o for 15bbs or so and the BB calls me with 47.

Almost exact same stack sizes ..

So done with online poker.. After taking a final shot tonight at the 82 turbo and 109 Ko

Actually, I've got some time now. I think I'll tell my Degen stories back, 'cause I'm feeling really good right now, and want analyse **** with much more clarity than when I'm depressed because of some huge loss.

This happened this past monday. I went out with some friends for drinks and some club later. They were celebrating the release of a documentary they made. I stayed there up untill 3 am, a little tipsy, but not really drunk.

I left the club, and instead of just going home, get some sleep, and go to work the following morning, I (of course), went to a local poker club to just play for an hour, make some cash and go to sleep happy with myself.

Arriving there, I noticed that I was little more drunk than I thought, I wasn't being able to properly stack the chips, shuffle the chips (like poker people do) and **** like that. But I think my drunkness actually helped me in some way. I bought in for 1k, and was playing 5-5 PLO. We were 7 Handed.

I played fairly Ok at the beginning, didn't do any spewy ****. Ran the stack up 2,100 and was feeling like a real cool and interesting person, and not some Degenerate Gambler

Than it happened, I had KQJ9ddss. Some tilted buy raised 40 UTG, two calls. I was already satisfied with the 800 I won (thinking "Cool, man, I already won back the drinks and the club, and a little money "), so I never raised with this pretty delicious hand.
4 to the Flop pot 170.
JdTd8c everyone checks, I just pot with my made straight and second nuts redraw. The steaming guy calls. At this point this ****er was peeling with any
gargabe.
The turn came, 2d. He checks, I bet 450. (I was thinking, ship the monies, bitch).
The river came 3c. He tanked for like 3 seconds and went all in for almost pot (1k) - I tanked for a bit, and was thinking "Look, this guy might be bluffing, and I'm still up in this thing, I'm not a degen and I'll just let him have it and call it quits.". Than I proceded in calling with the second nuts. He showed some A6d and collected the whole pot.

At this point, as usual, I would of course tilt my way into losing 5k - like it happened hundreds of times before. But not this night. Remember how I said the drinking was actually helping me? Really, I never tilted, I kept playing good, sound, and intelligent PLO (hahahahahahahaha). Up untill the point where I had like 2k again in front of me, from the first 1k buy in.

Two guys left the table, and I was thinking "Yeah man, it's 5am, I have to be up in 3 hours to go to work. I already have 1k profit. Let's go?" Then I propose to the guys at the table "How about we take the 2,3,4,5 and 6 from the deck. The flush beats the full." I actually don't know how this game in called in english, but around here we call it cap'd poker. - Anyone who has ever played this variety, knows how much of a degeneracy it is.

Off we went, I lost about 1,300 and was left with 700 and thinking "C'mon, take the 300 bucks loss and let's go.". And proceded playing sound poker, had a few breaks and had 2,500 again in front of me. It was 6am, I was super tired and still a bit drunk, but the depressed, type of drunk, you know the type. And said to myself "When I'm the SB I'm getting up". The button arrived to me AAKJds. The steaming guy raises to 100 (did I say I proposed the now we start playing 15-30? No? Yeah, I did that.) Everyone calls, and I thought about just calling with this beauty. I raised pot. Everyone is folding and I'm thinking (yeah, bitches, just gimme the cash so I can leave), but a guy who's really nitty pro, but have no clue about playing cap'd poker.

Pot was 1,300, the flop came T89r, the guy checks (he's got like 700 back, go figure?), I bomb the pot and he calls with the nut straight. The turn brings us the 8. And he asks if I want to run it 3 times. We do and he wins two times. Nice A in the river

I was still winning. After this pot I had like 1,8k in front of me. But I can't leave like this. We play some hands, it was 6:30 am.
And again, I'm the button (this button thing is really starting be the new tendency). I'm dealt QQT9s, the steaming guy again raises for 100 (he had like 600 in front of him, losing like 5k for the night - lots of degens roaming around, my friends)
Everyone calls, the flop, QT8r. The pro guy there bets 300 into 500, and I bomb the pot with my top set. I did this because of several intelligent and sound poker reasons that have no place in this thread. The steaming guy called with the 500 all in and the pro went all in as well.

There we had it. The dealer looked at me, like asking if I wanted to run it more than once. I just said calmly and softly to the dealer, "Run it only once, and run it slowly." - I always ask the dealers to run it slowly when I'm in a situation like this. I like savoring the moment.

The steaming guy shows us KK98, the "pro" shows us KJJ7. And what you know, my top set is WAY in front right now, Just the A and the 9. If the K hit, I would colletct the bigger pot. The turn was a 7. And the river brings as another 7. I say to the dealer, very slowly "Collect the rake and pay me."

I get up with $4,300 and leave.

Brag: Won 3,300 in the very last hand. The alcohol helped me to get a lot of self control and I never really tilted.

Beat: Left the club almost 7am and my day went like I was almost some kind of zombie.

Variance: I think I'm really good at PLO, but I've been here before. I know it all can go to ****.

I'll try and post more of my stories, and how I arrived here, I've been gambling for the past 7 years. Lots and lots of degen stories.

U could probably make a whole subcategory of degen stories that consist purely of people trying their hand at PLO, and they would all consist of people winning 2-3BI+ sized pots only to drop 4BI+ shortly after

My story takes place post Black Friday ... I had always been interested in poker in college and after hanging around a friend who played on tilt and stars religiously I figured I could take a shot playing online. Never really had too much success as I was learning the game and only made small 50$ deposits when I had a little extra cash from selling nugs. I remember my first big score was winning a 4$ 180 person sit n go playing like such a nit and winning a couple big flips. Anyway Black Friday happened I pretty much assumed poker was dead and I wouldn't play anymore because the live stakes were just not beatable for me having such a. Small roll and limited experience live (I still can't play live for some reason all strategy goes out the door). I end up graduating in 2012 which I still can't believe because I tried my hardest to **** up constantly and get in trouble. After graduating I don't immediately have a job because I'm naturally lazy and at this point in my life I'm pretty much stoned as hell everyday and passing a drug test isn't in the cards. I figure why not take a shot at making some extra cash with poker after winning like 5 nights in a row of our small home game (50$ sit n go). I go play 1-2 a few times and manage to do decent even though I played like such a nit it's amazing I actually got any action. So now I have a small roll of a few hundred bucks and someone at the casino tells me about bovada. Worst thing possible for me. I end up depositing 200$ and for a few nights I donk around winning a couple small stakes sit n gos. I basically have no strategy for game selection and constantly switch between full ring 6 max and Hu. I am starting to learn the game and despite having played above my roll I end up being semi successful and not losing too much. At this point my parents take notice of me slaving all day at the computer and want to know what the deal is. I lie to them and tell them i played a free roll and had the funds from that. My parents are hard working penny saving people who think gambling and poker are quite possibly the worst thing ever although now my parents actually enjoy poker and understand that with strategy and control it can be profitable . So Friday night I bring my laptop over to my buddies house to degen off some funds and play an MTt way above my roll and also smoke some bud. For me I couldn't really play poker without being stoned .. Go figure.. Anyway I end up getting second in a 10k for like 1200 bucks I think ?? My friend is going nuts thinks I'm like Phil Ivey and essentially starts reevaluating his life questioning why he doesn't learn poker .. So not I was over 2K roll on bovada and confidence is at an all time high...keep in mind my school loans are coming due in a month as I have been out of school for a little bit now . So Saturday i decide not to play cards and go out with some friends bragging about cashing that 10k and how I bluff shoved a miss diamond draw into AA on the river and got him to fold..never works for me usually .. Somehow it got through. So Sunday comes and I play a few sit n gos for 50$ early in the Morning win probably 3/6 and I'm close to even after fees. That's too boring though so I decide I'm going nut up and play the 150$ 100K guarantee for the first time. I had experience playing bigger tournies online but never for this buy in (I usually stayed at 50$ or Lower which is still too high). Go outside roast a bowl before my parents Come home and proceed to fire myself up about the action that is surely to come . I won't draw the tourney story out long but I start super ****ty almost bust and then double a few times . 4 hours in I'm still alive with a decent stack and tell myself to just make it though the next break . Well I end up playing extremely well during the middle stages which I can no longer seem to do in life and I have a monster stack at the bubble. 100 people left still huge...60 left still huge... 30 left you get the picture . At this point every break I'm downstairs talking to my parents telling them im in this tournament and first place is 22K and I'm doing well, but I didn't want to get their hopes up so when I bust they could be like see we told you it's gambling you never actually win . Well I get to the final table after a roller coaster with my stack going through all the short stack all ins. I had just successfully navigated a similar situation Friday making 3rd in the 10K so I had some experience . I start calling my friend who had bovada get his ass on my rail and were also talking on the phone. That actually really helped me to not play like a donk because I wanted him to think I was really good. I run hot at the final table and get my stack in good a bunch of times and make some very well timed steals and bluffs. It's heads up and I have an almost even chip stack with my opponent . He begins chatting me up in the chat box as we're both guaranteed 17k and he's pretty exstatic. At this point both my parents are sleeping and its 1:30 am , my friend is still on the rail and I'm looking to close this out . I play super Agro and hit a few flops , 12 hands later I get it all in with J5 on a J5K flop against AK and that's all she wrote I won 22K. So I start going ape **** , run to my parents room wake them up tell them I have 22K and that I out lasted 700 people blah blah blah I'm the Best. I remember waking up the next morning after not really sleeping and thinking that I dreamt the whole thing and having to log on to make sure I actually did win. Pretty comical but I was high as **** a lot back then like I said . The next day my parents have a pretty serious sit down with me and dissect my life it really wasn't the talk I thought that would come after a serious accomplishment like that but oh well life is tough. I tell my parents I'll be super conservative and that I understand the risks involved and that I play and advanced game I'm on another level essentially (oh ignorant youth) well they aren't buying it really and I can tell every time after this that I'm on the computer they're coming in to see if I'm playing cards . It basically got into my head and from that point forward my confidence is pretty much shot . I feel like poker is bad for me and I should never be playing and I try to hide it like a drug habit. This is definitely not conducive to a winning style of play . I still to this day haven't really recovered from that and my game will never be where it was I fear . I wasn't a top player by any definition but I think I did have more of an edge back then... Still tilts me to this day . This was the beginning of the end for me . For some reason I start playing cash exclusively , I think I did this because MtTs were so long and drawn out I didn't want to sit there and play all day with my parents watching so I found salvation on the 5-10 tables. After going through some pretty serious swings I decided to try 10-20 which was the highest buyin on bovada at this point (might still be ). I remember this day very clearly as this is still the largest losing day of my life and hopefully will be. My friend James was house/dog sitting for our friends family and he invited me over for the usual get high/veg sesh . I brought my laptop and wanted to get into some action while we were chilling . Hop on the 10/20 table (James thinks this is absurd people playing with 2k like they're pennies doesn't believe it's real money) oh how I wish it was play money now haha. Anyway I start playing 6- max and basically crush the table run it up to 4.5K getting lucky . I leave the table and decide to play 10/20 Hu . I win another buy in so I'm up 6.5 K in literally 45 minutes. Who needs a job when you're 22 and stack 6.5k an hour ... sHip it! Dude ends up quitting me heads up so I move back to 6- max I have around 30k on bovada now and the **** storm is about to begin . Early on I get dealt jj not a bad hand 6 handed so I raise two callers flop comes 3-8-10 two diamonds .. Check check I bet 150 one fold one call . Turn is a J checks to me I bet 450 snap call. At this point I put him on a flush. Draw and sure enough a diamond peels off on the river but he checks again and I bet 600 he comes over the top I call and lose of course to a flush . Pretty boring hand I know but I specifically remembered two hands from this session at that was one . I reload and lose another buy in pretty quickly . At this point in steaming being down 4K I've never gambled this high in my life and certainly never lost this much ...**** it I thought I'm getting coolered the cards will turn soon in my favor I say as o try to explain variance to James a concept I clearly had no idea about haha. So I'll speed this up and get to the point . I said o remembered two hands from the session and I'll talk about the other hand I remember . At this point I'm down 6K and I decide to fire one more bullet to chase my 6k loss I tell James if I don't get any back here I'm done and I'll walk with an 8 K loss and my head held low. Start to get some steam I end up getting my stack up to around 5 K after some pretty unbelievably juicy spots. I get dealt AKss in the button . It gets raised from early position and I reraise to 250$. Small kind calls and it goes back to the original raiser who makes it 600$ I being he idiot I am don't put him on a big pair because how could he have AA or KK when I have AK and the small blind calls? Well I 4 bet all in to 5 K and I get snap called from the original raiser after the small blind folds . He has pocket queens ... Board basically spits in my face 4-J-3 all diamonds he has the Q of diamonds of course ... Turn blank river blank ... fMl... James doesn't understand how AKss loses there ... I don't either and explain to him that I got coolered again how could he snap me off with QQ there etc etc... Great I'm down 8k I have close to 20 k left give or take a few hundred dollars . Take a few hours off and blaze some more of course. Now I'm feeling dangerous I decide to take another shot at 10/20, bad call as you could have guessed . I lose two buy ins in like 5 mins trying to see flops with suited connectors and Ax hands. Okay so now I have like 16k I should probably stop for a few days reevaluate my strategy and game selection and get my head on straight but I decide to play blackjack with the funds instead . Bovada blackjack is obvi the worst possible game to be playing when you're a degen with 16k available but somehow the gods are on my side and I run up a juicy 4K profit . Alright I'm starting the comeback I thought , **** those feelings from earlier I'm never going to feel that awful gut wrenching losing feeling like I experienced earlier I was sure of it . Then the worst decision of my life is made I tell James if I win another hand of black jack I'm going to bet my whole roll on the eagles playing Dallas on Sunday night football and if I lose the hand I'll bet the entire roll in black jack . What a genius idea bet my entire roll it took me so much time and energy to make not to mention the unbeliable stress of winning the tournament and dealing with my parents lying etc. well I lose the hand and start playing 500$ hands of blackjack ... Keep in mind I'm awful at blackjack I am by no means qualified to play 500$ hands... Ever... Takes about an hour of serious sweating to lose 18k ... I'm the sickest I've ever been in my life James stopped watching after I lose 10k and he's sitting in the other room looking at me when I walk I can tell he's hoping I turned it around and am going to tell him I'm +20k or some crazy **** . I have my head down I'm pale white . He knows what happened and didn't say too much about it although I do remember him asking me if I was going to be okay to which I replied ... Someday hahaha . I still to this can't seem to keep a run going without busting my whole roll as I have terrible Brm and game selection and I'm obvi addicted to the action . I just play for recreation on the sides these days I pretty much gave up trying to get my game to a pro level as I don't really have the time or energy so any deposit I make these days usually gets crucified rather quick and I have to wait for the next paycheck to get some hands in ... Kind of sad really haha. Student loans will probably be a savior for me though as any dispensable cash I have these days goes to pay them back and will until I'm dead probably . I usually deposit like 50$ play .10/.25 and get my soul crushed or try to bink a 50$ tourney ... One good thing about my whole story is I did get a pretty baller big screen with the last 2K I had to my name which I still have to this day and it's one of my favorite possessions in life . Moral of the story poker is not guaranteed it takes hard work studying bank roll management good game selection and unbelievable self control , things I still to this day can't seem to get a grasp of .....
Sorry for being so long and drawn out but I haven't ever really gotten to tell my story as no one I associate with understands poker and I'm usually way to emebraased as well .

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paragraph

Haha yes all one paragraph sorry for the bad grammar !

Was disappointed.

Expected you to degen off thousands and for you to miss work etc. For your boss to see you in the casino the night after work etc and fire your ass.
Grats on the win though. Your stories have potential I guess.

Why when you won the tourney didn't you slow down and properly assess your situation?

I'd take a break for weeks or even months and make sure my parents locked away like 90% of the money I won. Why didn't you spend it on irl stuff? I don't understand how people win tens of thousands then donk it off literally days later. It's absolute madness.

All valid points and I accept them obviously a more mature level headed person would have no trouble at all seeing the obvious such as that but like I said at the time I was not that person...
At the time I was 22 years old I honestly believed I was very good at poker and had a different understanding of the game then most. Being so you young all I wanted to do was play higher beat this person win this tournament etc... It didn't really matter to me to be smart and calculated as long as I was in action. Retrospectively speaking I made some of the biggest mistakes of my life back then and it's been hard to recover not just financially but mentally as well...

Update : I'm 26 live in southern Florida with my aunt and uncle ... Pay 600$ a month for my student loans and like I said any poker I play now usually consists of me depositing 50$ and not getting anywhere or playing a nightly tourney at a local casino and not having much luck ... But all being said I love poker I love the community and I just accept that I won't ever be a top player like I previously thought.. Not because I can't get lucky but because I genuinely don't have the self control or money management .

Never say never. You're 26. Anything is still possible.

Appreciate that man ... I know I guess I should say I'm not Actively pursuing anything serious ... Other than serious recreation haha

Playing the 2-1 columns on roulette has exactly the same odds as playing the numbers. Bet 12 chips on 1st column returns 36 total (24 win plus 12 back) . Put one chip on 12 numbers inside pays back 35+1=36 if you hit one. In fact playing any of the outside is the same. The only difference is in some places in Europe where you play even money shots and 0 comes in you get half back (or it goes to jail in France I think). This actually does make betting on red here in the UK better then betting on numbers by halving the house edge.


Blackjack "no-bust" strategy if you stick on anything above 11 increases the house edge to 10 or 15%.

Well, I was going to tell this particular story later. But since you asked:

About 4 years ago I was this really succesful financial markets guy, was making money and my career seemed to be in total right direction. But I was already a Super Degen. I'll tell how I arrived to this particular point later. But I was in debt almost 200k to various Poker Rooms, Banks, Family, etc. A friend of mine, actually had just hooked me up with 17k, in order to pay one casino debt.

So, to anyone who is a Super Degen, and it is in a situation like this (Playing everyday, not sleeping, having a huge Debt), you don't think straight. The time passes in a different way, you feel like you don't really have a hold of your life. You just, you know, be. But anyways.

I found myself in a way that I saw no way out, I couldn't tell my family, fianceé, friends, how ****ed up I really was. I actually didn't want to let anyone down - and I thought that if I could regroup my ****, I could come back to being a winning poker player and clear all this mess. Then, I decided to do a really idiotic thing: I went to one of the partners of the Hedge Fund I was working for, and asked him for an employees loan of about 150k. This kind of loan happens all the time in firms like this. What happens is that you need to have a good reason to ask for it, like you have cancer or things of the sort.

I invented some kind of crazy argument, and, to cut the story short, my boss fired my ass.

I got a very sizeble severance from it, and I'll tell you guys all about how I lost it all in about two weeks.

Peace

Hahaha. Moar.

What happened laters?
How is your life know??

regards