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Thin Value Bet?

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12-09-2008 , 09:24 PM

WackyPoker

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,440

Oceans-11 40/80 full ring.

Villain is in the BB and is a weak-passive.
MP limps, button limps, I limp in the SB with Kh9c, BB raises, all call.

Flop comes Qd5h7h. Checked around. Turn comes Ah. I bet, BB calls, rest fold. River comes Kc. My action, b/f, b/c, c/c, or c/f?

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12-09-2008 , 09:59 PM

Hobbs.

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 5,594

I vote c/f

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12-09-2008 , 10:13 PM

MitchL

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 8,521

agree.

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12-09-2008 , 10:31 PM

9.5fingershuffle

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 5,350

I also vote check the turn.

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12-09-2008 , 11:24 PM

Bremen

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 15,799

A weak passive raises out of the BB and you're going to try bluffing him on an A turn after he checks the flop???

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12-10-2008 , 12:28 AM

Hobbs.

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 5,594

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bremen

A weak passive raises out of the BB and you're going to try bluffing him on an A turn after he checks the flop???

I don't think this is too unreasonable as a weak passive isn't raising a ton of A high hands out of the blinds and very often is check JJ and less on the flop because he's a huge vag

Last edited by Hobbs.; 12-10-2008 at 12:30 AM. Reason: edit: PJ, excuse me for the terrible grammer (I just saw your oot thread) but i just can't be bother on the itnerwebs

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12-10-2008 , 01:24 AM

Bremen

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Aug 2004 Posts: 15,799

If he raises JJ preflop he is probably firing on the flop. To me his line is entirely consistent with AK which checks because he is "drawing".

As played; I concur that c/f seems best.

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12-10-2008 , 08:35 AM

PlayEveryHand

journeyman

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 287

Your action is - CHECK TURN !!!

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12-10-2008 , 03:05 PM

kiddo

veteran

Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 3,047

yes, check turn... BB was waiting for that A... if he wasnt he got a pocketpair he will NEVER fold... but that said its silly to not bet-fold river since u will have to call his bet if u check... some guys in here say checkfold, unless they are ironic i would love to play in that game... i havent checkfolded such a hand after this action since 2002

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12-10-2008 , 04:07 PM

#10

Scarmiglio

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 628

Anyone simply fold preflop? Is a hand like K9o really worth 2 more chips in the sb? Even after we limp once the BB raises isn't this hand then a fold?

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12-10-2008 , 07:41 PM

#11

WackyPoker

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,440

Quote:

Originally Posted by kiddo

True, maybe I should have just check/called the turn, and the check/folded the river, but this particular player was so passive, after I rivered a King, and he didn't raise the turn, I actually thought I had the best hand, but it was close. Thus the very thin value bet by me. Not all value bets work out after all.

Spoiler:

Last edited by WackyPoker; 12-10-2008 at 07:49 PM.

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12-10-2008 , 07:47 PM

#12

Scarface24

journeyman

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 270

this is limit, you don't bet into a wk passive when the money card hits the turn. C/c turn and c/f river

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12-10-2008 , 07:53 PM

#13

Tryptamean

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 9,844

Quote:

Originally Posted by WackyPoker

True, maybe I should have just check/called the turn, and the check/folded the river, but this particular player was so passive, after I rivered a King, and he didn't raise the turn, I actually thought I had the best hand, but it was close. Thus the very thin value bet by me. Not all value bets work out after all.

I dont see why you think this. Also, worse hands that will call you check behind anyway. you get called and lose to Ax so often that its a bad bet.

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12-11-2008 , 08:08 PM

#14

jesse8888

Yes, you barred

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 16,685

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarmiglio

Anyone simply fold preflop? Is a hand like K9o really worth 2 more chips in the sb? Even after we limp once the BB raises isn't this hand then a fold?

No and no imo.

As for the rest of the hand, I think like everyone has said betting the turn is just silly.

Wacky, were you around Monday - Wednesday 9 to 5 this week? If so, who were you? Who I was should have been, well, freaking obvious.

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12-11-2008 , 08:19 PM

#15

WackyPoker

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,440

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesse8888

Nope, I was in the office during those hours. I did play Sunday and Wednesday nights though.

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12-11-2008 , 08:31 PM

#16

jesse8888

Yes, you barred

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 16,685

Quote:

Originally Posted by WackyPoker

Nope, I was in the office during those hours. I did play Sunday and Wednesday nights though.

I was drunk at those times in the Gaslamp Quarter.

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12-11-2008 , 09:09 PM

#17

WackyPoker

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,440

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesse8888

I was drunk at those times in the Gaslamp Quarter.

Hope you had a good time in the Gaslamp Quarter. I'm not much of a club-goer or party person myself.

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12-12-2008 , 06:34 PM

#18

Scarmiglio

grinder

Join Date: Sep 2005 Posts: 628

Quote:

Originally Posted by jesse8888

No and no imo.

I'll give you that calling for 2 chips after 2 limpers is fine - especially figuring that the BB is weak passive and unlikely to raise, but when the BB does raise (remember - weak/passive) why would you call? If you were in the BB and the SB raised preflop would you still call with K9o? Maybe I'm too tight, or maybe I've read too much Tommy Angelo, but I'm folding weak offsuit kings here every time. Heck, I'm probably folding KJo to a raise here. A weak passive's raising range has us crushed way too often plus he has position on us. Yuck.

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12-12-2008 , 07:00 PM

#19

WackyPoker

old hand

Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 1,440

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scarmiglio

Agreed, if the weak/passive is in the small blind and he raises, K9o hits the muck. Getting 7:1 on a call preflop, my 2 chips are going in. After the BB raises and all call, again I'm getting 7:1 again on a call, my chips are going in as they did in this case. Most of the time I expect to lose, but I think the times I hit and get paid off make up for the times I lose 1 BB. But possibly not, and maybe I should just give it up after the BB raises. Still it's tough spot to pass up getting 7:1, even if I am a likely dog. Surely the my equity should be greater than 25%? Maybe I'll poke around stove a little and see. Might change my mind on things.

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