Lol it would probably work out quite well in a sitcom kind of way

One thing Hoya mentioned that I think the organized left really needs to think about: How to re-frame these debates in terms that actually reach the Average American. The right is killer at choosing phrasing that invokes a reaction or tugs at the heartstrings ("baby parts", etc.) But the left seems to have such a need to intellectualize everything in a dispassionate manner. We euthanize the impact of terrible events through euphemisms, while not using the power of language to stir PASSION in the base for our ideas.

I don't mean to get too personal. But I get HEATED more than just about anything at the accusations of back-patting or disingenuousness. I may not have all the answers, but I am actively interested in these problems and in finding out what the solutions are. I've never once gotten satisfaction in my life from being right about something and watching it crash and burn because the people minding it wouldn't listen to me.

I just gotta make a rule that I can't debate anyone who immediately jumps to the "smug, back-patting, self-aggrandizing" personal attack instead of debating ideas and policy.

It's harder to stir the passions of a more diverse crowd.

I thought he was referring to the inspired and inspiring works of Da Vinci and Michelangelo.

PM me for coaching rates.

The thing is, it's trivially easy to create/acquire mass killing devices that have nothing to do with guns and that guns, especially assault rifles, are best used as defense weapons. If only we could ignore all of that and spout things like "common sense gun laws" because of feels, especially when "common sense gun laws" doesn't really make much sense and will invariably lead to "lists" and "certain people" not being allowed to protect themselves while we continue to progress towards a more divided/anxious/scared/poor society rife with economic disparity.(I'm not arguing this part is any side's fault, it's just the reality of our era)


Hoya,

I think there would be less White mass murders/acts of terrorism if we lived in a more homogeneous society, and I am not arguing for that I am just saying that the right's narrative argues for that and thus you can't say they're not willing to do anything about it.

I agree that framing and language are incredibly important.

But also, "there seem to be a lot of gun deaths, and that seems to be more the case here than in other countries where there are less guns and less gun ownership" is harder to phrase than "THEY'RE TRYING TO TAKE YOUR PENIS GUNS."

Disagree with this. Dumbing down to try to manipulate dumbs better than right does would create it's own set of problems. Stick to guns. Be smart. World will come around eventually.

Lol, I guess your agenda is fine(I'm against mass murders too!) but you are influenced by the narratives of those with other agendas and the innate need to feel that what you believe in is right

Certain poster should NEVER get his name off of the title of the bad poster thread.

lol. you wanna know which list of people would not be allowed to carry guns if common sense gun laws were enacted? That list would be all people inside the US border with the exceptions of on duty law enforcement and military.

Once one realizes that the minimum amount of gun ownership (~no guns like Japan) would mean a (likely large) drop in violent crime, suicide and gun deaths, the question becomes "how much less do we need" since we are at the maximum amount of global gun ownership. The idea that less won't help those issues is preposterous and for it to come from some in a group of smart people like this is completely mind boggling.

LOL

Year 2015 is when the forum went to hell. Tut and dkbro (not really dkbro) no longer challenge and engage Ikes instead

What a time to be alive

And these costs are all set too high relative to other developed nations that are also providing a higher quality of care than we are in the US. If Americans were truly demanding the best health care they would go to Europe.

thayer, why dont you try to create one of these devices? Hopefully it will explode in your face as you open the package of gunpowder.

Official SE Politics Thread. After mod discussion, we're doing it. Godspeed.

Also sando I disagree completely with the 'attacking someone for condolences is in bad taste'

If you're offering sympathies directly to someone directly impacted by a tragedy attacking that is distasteful, sure

Someone on facebook with a few hundred friends who aren't in the region impacted much less actually impacted, who exactly are you offering your sympathies to? What good are they besides attention whoring?

It's a pretty lame practice

wtf are you even talking about?

There's nothing more trivially easy than buying an assault rifle and shooting people. Of course people *can* build home-made devices and the such, but it's still much more complicated to actually pull something like that off.

And how is an assault rifle "best used as a defense weapon"?? This is a weapon that shoots out a lot of bullets, that can go very far and through things, and allows you to easily kill many people in a short span of time, but makes it relatively difficult to focus all of your fire on a single target. In what defense situations is that necessary / helpful?

Protect themselves from what, man? Get a dog. 100% of statistics show that people with guns are more likely to hurt themselves or family members than prevent attacks or thefts.

It's the opposite of "feels", it's basic logic, it's historical evidence, it's international studies, it's the very definition of evidence-based programs.

And yes, "certain people", like those with serious mental health issues, should not have guns. This is not to prevent them being able to protect themselves since, again, folks with serious mental health issues are significantly more likely than average to use those guns to hurt themselves or put themselves / family members into a position where they can be hurt or killed.

Again, just what in the actual **** are you talking about?

The overwhelming majority of white murders, including mass-murders and acts that would be considered terrorism, are against other white people.

You're a reasonable guy. Is this performance art or something?

I'm not gonna move the entire debate over the last 48 hours into the Politics thread (which needs a funny nickname), but we should be migrating these discussions with the immediacy.

I plan on live blogging ep 1 in like 4 hours

Thats cool and I see the reasoning, but by taking it out of here it instantly loses its appeal(at least for me) and becomes just another politics thread.

grumble, I mean I get you but having both doesn't really do anything at all, the people who spacebar and hate it are still gonna hate it in here, other thread will be diminished

obv your call, not gonna be getting MAD if you continue the discussion here