NBA Modern Era Single Season Draft Discussion - Page 47 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

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07-21-2009 , 07:41 PM

#1151

EPiPeN11

banned

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,605

Quote:

Originally Posted by sethypooh21

What are you basing this on?

everything i've ever heard/when I saw Pippen play etc? I mean I could be wrong but I really don't think so but will gladly listen to why.

Thought it was common knowledge pippen was the best defensive SF of all time (or at least better than Erving was). If u think otherwise its up to u to back it up.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:41 PM

#1152

Assani Fisher

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Quote:

Originally Posted by kidcolin

assuming full health but then discounting something like TMac's sick year is really inconsistent. What a dumb draft. At least Barkley rules.

explain how?

You get full health guaranteed.

And you get the player at any age you wish.

The only thing you don't get is a guarantee that he'll put up the same stats in this league as in real life. Real life contains a lot of luck and variance, and so will this league. Most players ran slightly well in their best statistical year. Therefore, its very useful to look at surrounding years as well.

that seems perfectly consistent to me.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:43 PM

#1153

Assani Fisher

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I agree with Epi that the onus is on the people who claim Dr.J > Pippen on defense.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:43 PM

#1154

EPiPeN11

banned

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,605

Quote:

Originally Posted by Assani Fisher

this, infact it's pretty much a guarentee NONE of these players will be putting up the same stats due to being on stacked teams, only having 1 basketball ldo, facing much tougher competition etc

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:44 PM

#1155

Seadood228

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Calling Pippen an elite level wing defender is like saying Wilt got laid a lot. Even though it's a compliment, I'm not sure if it's doing the man justice. When I said (and semi-redacted) that Julius was the best wing defender, I'd obviously forgotten about Scottie.

I really like the pick and think he's pretty clearly the BSFA at this time. He's one of those players who transcend their position, which should give you some flexibility in later rounds.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:46 PM

#1156

Assani Fisher

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Pippen is obviously good value btw and was worth trading up for. I also thought you paid a fairly small price to move up. I would've asked for at least 2nd/3rd round move ups in exchange.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:46 PM

#1157

mjw0586

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I think McGrady's getting very underrated. Ill be able to go into more detail tonight when I have a computer. But, the guy was just sick good at his best.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:47 PM

#1158

Assani Fisher

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Quote:

Originally Posted by EPiPeN11

this, infact it's pretty much a guarentee NONE of these players will be putting up the same stats due to on stacked teams, only having 1 basketball ldo, facing much tougher competition etc

Epi,

This is a really minor issue, and I promise you that I'm "chill" and just want to discuss it for future drafts....

But don't you see now how its much more confusing for people to pick a season than it is to pick an age? Picking a season makes people overrate their real life stats in that one season way too much imo, and I feel like its pretty clear that you don't want that.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:49 PM

#1159

Jerrod Ankenman

grinder

Join Date: Jun 2004 Posts: 679

Quote:

Originally Posted by Assani Fisher

I agree with Epi that the onus is on the people who claim Dr.J > Pippen on defense.

Where amazing happens commercial proves that Pippen sucks.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:49 PM

#1160

Assani Fisher

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Quote:

Originally Posted by mjw0586

I think McGrady's getting very underrated. Ill be able to go into more detail tonight when I have a computer. But, the guy was just sick good at his best.

I'd be interested in debating this with you after a few more wings have gone. I think theres quite a few wings left that I'd take over McGrady.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:50 PM

#1161

MEb

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Seadood228

Calling Pippen an elite level wing defender is like saying Wilt got laid a lot.

It's funny cuz I wanted to go for the type of claim of best defensive SF ever, but toned it down for fear of getting into a long argument over it. Happy to hear that I may have actually undersold my pick.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:51 PM

#1162

EPiPeN11

banned

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,605

Quote:

Originally Posted by Assani Fisher

The thing is I don't see how it is confusing (although I do agree a few people are being confused but hope that our explanations the past few posts have cleared it up).

I mean everyone understood what this meant in the NFL draft, don't see why it's such a hard concept to grasp, it's really not difficult. Hopefully after our explanations people will understand what it means and it won't be an issue.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:51 PM

#1163

BobboFitos

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07-21-2009 , 07:51 PM

#1164

NameOnTheCake

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Quote:

Originally Posted by iggymcfly

While the one year was far and away ahead of the other years, the surrounding years were still pretty darn good. He put up a PER of 25.1 in 01/02 and put up a PER of 25.3 in 03/04, the two years surrounding the huge season. That's a 3-year average of 26.9. Compare that to Kobe who's 3-year average surrounding his best season was 25.8 including a PER of 23.3 in 04/05.

And Kobe actually had higher usage stats over that period so it's not like he was more efficient than T-Mac. It was just a case where his slightly higher TS% was counteracted by T-Mac's significantly lower turnover rate and slightly better rebounding and passing numbers.

I do think Kobe's a better man defender which is enough to make him the slightly better player over that time period, but they're really, really close. I only have peak Kobe 2 spots ahead of peak T-Mac on my big board.

Quote:

Originally Posted by kidcolin

assuming full health but then discounting something like TMac's sick year is really inconsistent. What a dumb draft. At least Barkley rules.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:53 PM

#1165

Franchise 60

deliciously angry

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 42,744

Someone PM me when the suck stops.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:54 PM

#1166

Assani Fisher

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reading through some of the old thread...I think this was my favorite Epi comment on McHale(to be fair to EPiPeN, a lot of us would look bad if someone singled out ONE single comment they made a long time ago....I'm just posting this for fun, not to mock him):

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franchise 60

You made claims that Barkley wasn't that much of a better rebounder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by EPiPeN11

I don't think he was (especially defensive rebounding in which case I think McHale might have been better although Barkley was the better offensive rebounder)...put Barkley on the Celtics teams and I don't think he gets over 10 rpg and if he does it's not much more.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:58 PM

#1167

Assani Fisher

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anyway, did someone PM WaterWalker?

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:59 PM

#1168

EPiPeN11

banned

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,605

lol ya i'll admit I was wrong on that assani although I def do believe that his rebounds would be lower if he played on the celtics which was a stacked rebounding team and that Barkley was not a great defensive rebounder (although he was very good). He was however a great offensive rebounder and one of the best of all time at this and is obv a significantly better rebounder than McHale was.

I do still think McHale's rebounding was underrated due to playing on such a stacked rebounding team.

Last edited by EPiPeN11; 07-21-2009 at 08:04 PM.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 07:59 PM

#1169

WaterWalker

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 3,901

Round 1, Pick 28

Amare Stoudamire PF

With all these great defensive players getting picked in the first round, I only found it fitting to give you guys someone to defend.

With no injuries....and with no Shaq slowing him down...Amare will be ready to thrown down some thunderous layups and some sweet like butta dunks....to go along with his swishalicious mid range game...and his bootylicious inside game (i dont get it either

).

Anyway, lets get down to the nitty gritty...

2007-2008
79 games
25.2ppg/9.1rpg/2.1bpg
PER: 27.6
TS%: 656%
FG%: 590%
ORTG: 124
DRTG: 104
OWS: 11.4
WS: 15.3

http://www.basketball-reference.com/...stoudam01.html

Team so far:

Amare Stoudamire 2007-2008

Quote

07-21-2009 , 08:00 PM

#1170

EPiPeN11

banned

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,605

Quote:

Originally Posted by Assani Fisher

anyway, did someone PM WaterWalker?

ya i did

Quote

07-21-2009 , 08:01 PM

#1171

Seadood228

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Quote:

Originally Posted by NameOnTheCake

+1

+2

This is not a good endorsement coming from the guy who spent $160 on a couple DNP CD Nugs bench players...

I kid

Quote

07-21-2009 , 08:02 PM

#1172

Assani Fisher

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Two of the people who PMed me for advice were looking at Amare. I didn't try to talk either of them out of it, as I just want to give basic advice and not my exact opinions. But I'm just not a fan of building around a weak post defender as your first pick at all. Maybe thats just my personal preference though.

Quote

07-21-2009 , 08:03 PM

#1173

EPiPeN11

banned

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 18,605

don't like the amare pick

Quote

07-21-2009 , 08:03 PM

#1174

Assani Fisher

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looks like we still needs the owners to pick seasons for Hakeem, Dwight, and Yao btw

Quote

07-21-2009 , 08:04 PM

#1175

flyingmoose

veteran

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 2,224

Quote:

Originally Posted by EPiPeN11

this, infact it's pretty much a guarentee NONE of these players will be putting up the same stats due to being on stacked teams, only having 1 basketball ldo, facing much tougher competition etc

Wait, you mean when I draft a team with a total usage of 180%, not all my players will get the same stats they got in real life?

Quote

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