Two Plus Two Publishing LLC Two Plus Two Publishing LLC
 

Go Back   Two Plus Two Poker Forums > >

Sporting Events Discussion centered around sporting events.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 06-23-2008, 08:27 PM   #13701
NopairParker
old hand
 
NopairParker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Little Armenia
Posts: 1,386
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
Epipen's team:

1. I think you've raped people in trades. Picks have so much more value early on.

2. McHale and Martin and Bell were solid picks for sure. Like those a lot.

3. I think Deron Williams was just too much value to pass up for Billups, but I do understand your point about defense/3point shooting combo that Billups gives you. Still I think it was a mistake.

4. Deng is a tough one to call. YOu're 100% right that he goes much higher a year ago, but thats only because a year ago we thought he was still improving each and every year...and now we may have seen his peak already. Eh, its an ok pick but nothing special.

5. Perkins is ok imo...nothing special.



Personally I would've loved to see you address center earlier. Maybe Theo Ratliff instead of Deng. That would give you a starting 5 of:

Billups
Martin
Bell
McHale
Ratliff

I think thats a better team that what you have.


Overall I do like your team though. Defensively they're above average(but not elite at all). Offensively I think they're really solid and should work well together. Definitely a top 10 offense in this league, arguably even one of the best.

I think you have to exlude this years stats from all the bulls players drafted. Everyones stats suffered because of outside the court matter ruined the team game, and everyone was out there for different reasons ( trades, contracts, coaching issues. ) I sitll value dang pretty high.

He plays like a combination of James Worthy and Caron butler. I like his game a lot.

I wouldnt like ratliff for this team as he will just clog up the paint on offense and mchale will have less room to operate in there.
NopairParker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:29 PM   #13702
D104
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
D104's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: In a better place.
Posts: 18,272
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Me and xorbie arein communication and would share the team, if that's fine with everyone.

D
D104 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:29 PM   #13703
BobboFitos
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
BobboFitos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Cambridge, MA
Posts: 72,764
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

I don't know why everyone keeps saying we all have offensive juggernauts. Look at the teams we have. Try to isolate the best offenses. Compare those offenses to this years best offensive teams: Phx, Utah, LAL. are the best offenses better?
BobboFitos is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:29 PM   #13704
NopairParker
old hand
 
NopairParker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Little Armenia
Posts: 1,386
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
I disagree with pretty much everything you say here.
elaborate.... im curious..
NopairParker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:32 PM   #13705
horizon
old hand
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,501
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Two reasons why defenders are overrated in this draft:
- Zone defense: Since you can play zone, you can hide the weakest defender., and one on one defense loses of its value.
A good defensive coach can make your team into a decent defensive team, no matter who theplayer on the roster are.
- Hand check Rules: Perimeter defenders lose of their value as they are not as effective as they once were.
horizon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:32 PM   #13706
Seadood228
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Seadood228's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rossmoor, CA
Posts: 30,306
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobboFitos View Post
I don't know why everyone keeps saying we all have offensive juggernauts. Look at the teams we have. Try to isolate the best offenses. Compare those offenses to this years best offensive teams: Phx, Utah, LAL. are the best offenses better?
I think so. 1-3 definitely not, perhaps 4. But 5-10 they definitely will be, and you will on average get about 120 minutes out of your top four guys, which is about 1/2 the time. Some teams may stretch that to 160 or so, but that would be risking a shorter career. Overall I think there will be much more balance, which I think benefits teams who have people who can play off the ball, coupled with guys who love to pass.

All imo, obv.
Seadood228 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:34 PM   #13707
cowboy2579
adept
 
cowboy2579's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 2+2 obv
Posts: 1,104
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Give BigCat's team to D/X, drop Tarpley and give NPP's pick to D/X?
cowboy2579 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:35 PM   #13708
capone0
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
capone0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Philly
Posts: 43,034
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

1-10 these teams will kill the PHX, Utah and LALs of the league imo. Our 10s will be some teams 4th or 5th options. 1-5 PHX, Utah, LAL are definitely better.
capone0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:36 PM   #13709
horizon
old hand
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,501
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobboFitos View Post
I don't know why everyone keeps saying we all have offensive juggernauts. Look at the teams we have. Try to isolate the best offenses. Compare those offenses to this years best offensive teams: Phx, Utah, LAL. are the best offenses better?
Hidden Brag? Your offense definitely is.
horizon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:36 PM   #13710
NopairParker
old hand
 
NopairParker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Little Armenia
Posts: 1,386
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobboFitos View Post
I don't know why everyone keeps saying we all have offensive juggernauts. Look at the teams we have. Try to isolate the best offenses. Compare those offenses to this years best offensive teams: Phx, Utah, LAL. are the best offenses better?

On paper the Jazz offense this year, would rank really high in my book against alot of the offenses in the draft. I would certainly take them over my current team.
NopairParker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:37 PM   #13711
kidcolin
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
kidcolin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: thank god for the hatchery
Posts: 108,763
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
KC's team is underrated by this board imo
I don't want to sound like a whiny *****, but I am to some extent, and I feel like people have just completely forgotten how utterly dominant Bird was. And he was no slouch defensively. 2 2nd team nods.

Basically I think the reason my team is underrated is that Bird is white, and guys like Dale and Vlade are themselves underrated (Dale especially), and even Cassell to some extent (recency bias ftw.. dude could pass).
kidcolin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:38 PM   #13712
NopairParker
old hand
 
NopairParker's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Little Armenia
Posts: 1,386
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by cowboy2579 View Post
Give BigCat's team to D/X, drop Tarpley and give NPP's pick to D/X?
am i being skipped again ?
NopairParker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:42 PM   #13713
cowboy2579
adept
 
cowboy2579's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 2+2 obv
Posts: 1,104
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by NopairParker View Post
am i being skipped again ?
everyone wins!
cowboy2579 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:43 PM   #13714
capone0
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
capone0's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Philly
Posts: 43,034
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by kidcolin View Post
I don't want to sound like a whiny *****, but I am to some extent, and I feel like people have just completely forgotten how utterly dominant Bird was. And he was no slouch defensively. 2 2nd team nods.

Basically I think the reason my team is underrated is that Bird is white, and guys like Dale and Vlade are themselves underrated (Dale especially), and even Cassell to some extent (recency bias ftw.. dude could pass).
I'm looking at DD's stat line what's so special about him?
capone0 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:43 PM   #13715
Victor
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Victor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,790
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by D104 View Post
Me and xorbie arein communication and would share the team, if that's fine with everyone.

D
yes. gogoggogogoggogogogogogogog
Victor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:44 PM   #13716
TheQuietAnarchist
Formerly xorbie
 
TheQuietAnarchist's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 22,826
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Alex's team would be the best offensive team in the league this year. Ruffneck's would be elite. BiigChip's would be elite. Bobbo's would be elite. epi's would be elite. And a lot of teams besides those would have very good offenses that are more along the lines of Celtics/Hornets/Raptors/Warriors - very good but not elite.
TheQuietAnarchist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:45 PM   #13717
kidcolin
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
kidcolin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: thank god for the hatchery
Posts: 108,763
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by BobboFitos View Post
+1, I think Steroid Boy is held under the most intense scrutiny since he has MJ (obv) and his team is midlevel at best compared to some of the other teams imo.
yeah it's a little unfair. I think his team is good, but it could be absolutely balla. His 2nd round choice was tough, though. I didn't like camby there, but then you risk never getting a big. I would have loved Detlef there.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post
I agree with this, but I think I'm higher on Smith than you are. I think that while his team is definitely not the best, they could easily upset any team in a best of 7 series because Jordan can go off and when Smith is getting steals/blocks and getting out in transition he can be very effective.
I'd be higher on Smith if it weren't for Camby. It's really the whole pairing of everything. But even still, I like Smith, but just looking at guys drafted after him it's clear he went a bit high.
kidcolin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:45 PM   #13718
Victor
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Victor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 65,790
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

assani, give the blessing so that d/x can get their pick up while they are still on tonight.
Victor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:46 PM   #13719
horizon
old hand
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,501
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Assani Fisher View Post

Loved the first four picks, hated how Lever fits with the team. I think Heinrich definitely would've been a better choice.

BTW...can Lebron actually play the point full time on offense? I don't mean like he does in real life; I mean full time PG. If so then I would've loved taking Bowen as your fifth starter. On offense it gives you another shooter, and you don't really need much else since your team is pretty set on offense with Lebron scoring and creating open shots for others. And it would obviously help on D...yeah you'd probably have to have Bowen guard the other team's PG, but hes shown he can do that when he defends Nash or Paul, right? You'd probably be "wasting" some of his defensive excellence by occassionally having him guarding guys like Rondo who are little threat, but overall I think it may work.

IF you ignore that strategy, I think Hinrich would've been a better fit here.

But yea...this is a tough tough team imo. Like it a lot.
It's funny because Hinrich was my first choice, and I took Lever because I felt like it was a steal at that point and he was overall much better than Lever.
I would have taken Hinrcih if the draft hade been made last year, but I was scared of taking two players in a row with mysterious decline years
horizon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:47 PM   #13720
ClarkNasty
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
ClarkNasty's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: 10x the man Clarkmeister is
Posts: 35,385
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Are we in agreement with the following process for declaring a "winner":

1. Everyone force-rank franchises 1-39 (excluding self obv) based on "which I'd rather own". That's obviously subjective as some will rank short term way higher than long term, and all sorts of things in between. Good for debate.

2. Top 16 teams based on total points (39pts for 1st vote, 38pts for 2nd vote, etc) pair off in a "which franchise would I rather own" playoff style bracket with seedings.

3. Each matchup gets a thread, and we progress single elimination style until there is a winner.
ClarkNasty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:47 PM   #13721
cowboy2579
adept
 
cowboy2579's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 2+2 obv
Posts: 1,104
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Victor View Post
yes. gogoggogogoggogogogogogogog
+1
cowboy2579 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:47 PM   #13722
Seadood228
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
Seadood228's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Rossmoor, CA
Posts: 30,306
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by kidcolin View Post
I don't want to sound like a whiny *****, but I am to some extent, and I feel like people have just completely forgotten how utterly dominant Bird was. And he was no slouch defensively. 2 2nd team nods.
I think this team fits like a glove. Cassell was a beast for a long long time, and could pass. Bird are you kidding me? One of the best players ever, could shoot the lights out, play great D, and could pass. John Starks is probably my least fave pick, but I still like it. His D was relentless (check out the Utah/NYK game I posted earlier), and he could pass. Dale D was a defensive beast and ultimate garbage man, and scored efficiently. Ricky Peirce was a super-efficient high volume guy. Vlade is seriously underrated on both ends of the court, and could pass.

So KC has a team with above average passing and excellent efficiency. The passing will make his offense even more efficient imo. Defensively his team is very good, with a few of his guys being top 5ish when they were in the league (Bird, Starks, Dale, and perhaps even Vlade).

Seriously underrated imo. And quite possibly the best offensive squad overall.
Seadood228 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:48 PM   #13723
horizon
old hand
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,501
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by kidcolin View Post
I don't want to sound like a whiny *****, but I am to some extent, and I feel like people have just completely forgotten how utterly dominant Bird was. And he was no slouch defensively. 2 2nd team nods.

Basically I think the reason my team is underrated is that Bird is white, and guys like Dale and Vlade are themselves underrated (Dale especially), and even Cassell to some extent (recency bias ftw.. dude could pass).
ah! You see how awesome offense get underrated!
horizon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:49 PM   #13724
cowboy2579
adept
 
cowboy2579's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: 2+2 obv
Posts: 1,104
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Quote:
Originally Posted by ClarkNasty View Post
Are we in agreement with the following process for declaring a "winner":

1. Everyone force-rank franchises 1-39 (excluding self obv) based on "which I'd rather own". That's obviously subjective as some will rank short term way higher than long term, and all sorts of things in between. Good for debate.

2. Top 16 teams based on total points (39pts for 1st vote, 38pts for 2nd vote, etc) pair off in a "which franchise would I rather own" playoff style bracket with seedings.

3. Each matchup gets a thread, and we progress single elimination style until there is a winner.
I think this is the way to go. Do we only give votes to owners or are we going to open up the vote to SE?

Last edited by cowboy2579; 06-23-2008 at 08:56 PM.
cowboy2579 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-23-2008, 08:50 PM   #13725
kidcolin
Carpal \'Tunnel
 
kidcolin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: thank god for the hatchery
Posts: 108,763
Re: Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion

Dale D is like 8th all time on the offensive glass or something. soo sick.

Quote:
I sitll value dang pretty high.
Not sure if this typo was on purpose, but I hope so, cuz I like it. Man I totally want to see Deng replicas spelled this way.
kidcolin is offline   Reply With Quote

Reply
      

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 02:33 AM.


Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 2008-2020, Two Plus Two Interactive