Modern Era NBA Build a Franchise Draft Discussion - Let's Get'er Done - Page 213 - Sporting Events and Fantasy Sports

after this is all done are you guys going to run simuls dungeons and dragons style? roll a 20 side die to see if penny recovers well from surgery... 12 sided die to see who gets injured when...

i love this thread and concept but it is getting kind of lol with all this speculation

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05-20-2008 , 06:07 PM

#5302

LurchySoprano

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I don't hate the Penny pick, but I do find it interesting that Assani was meh on my selection of Robertson because of his "short six year peak" and then he selects a guy in Hardaway who had a much shorter peak.

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05-20-2008 , 06:15 PM

#5303

Franchise 60

deliciously angry

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 42,744

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mano

Nobody ever said he IS a top 20 player for the last 30 seasons. IF he was never injured AND he maintained the level of performance of his first few years, he probably would have been regarded in that category. I was just responding to the "people overrate how good Penny was before the injury" statement - he was very good, and you of all people should agree that this format makes him a good value at #75.

I think that saying "If healthy hes imo a top 20 player in this entire draft," is overrating Penny Hardaway based on one great season, one very good season, and some decent seasons where he missed a bunch of games.

Take a look at the top 20, its kinda stacked for claims like this to be made.

And as Assani stated in his OP, we don't know if he'll get injured. But I can say with a lot more certainty that he will get hurt then anyone can regarding him not getting hurt. The reason? Because from 25 on he was a mess.

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05-20-2008 , 06:20 PM

#5304

cowboy2579

adept

Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 1,104

IMO:

You can evaluate the draft in 2 ways: long-term prognosis and 1-year prognosis. Oft-injured players can give you a big boost to your 1-year chance of winning but be a liability in terms of the long-term viability of your franchise. Take Kevin McHale for example - he sucks at everything, but is especially likely to be injured, so he hurts both your 1-year chance and your franchise. Most players have a certain tradeoff instead of purely negative value, like McHale.

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05-20-2008 , 06:21 PM

#5305

nath

the second coming of the second coming

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 68,688

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franchise 60

getting 3rd and 10th in MVP voting for two seasons doesn't make you a top 20 player of the past 30 seasons.

well, that's probably why he went 75th and not 20th

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05-20-2008 , 06:24 PM

#5306

snowden

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 2,527

Quote:

Originally Posted by cowboy2579

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05-20-2008 , 06:25 PM

#5307

Franchise 60

deliciously angry

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 42,744

Quote:

Originally Posted by nath

well, that's probably why he went 75th and not 20th

I don't think you are getting my point. Assani picks Penny, then says he is a huge steal and is a top 20 player when healthy. Then he argues why he may stay healthy. So he is pretty much arguing that Penny very well could be a top 20 player in this format. I am arguing that even if he does stay healthy, there isn't enough evidence to claim he is a top 20 player when healthy.

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05-20-2008 , 06:27 PM

#5308

Victor

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I am arguing that even if he does stay healthy, there isn't enough evidence to claim he is a top 20 player when healthy

using assanis argument, bynum is a great pick too.

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05-20-2008 , 06:27 PM

#5309

D104

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05-20-2008 , 06:29 PM

#5310

nath

the second coming of the second coming

Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 68,688

Quote:

Originally Posted by Franchise 60

Nah, I did get your point. Whether or not he stays healthy is obv a huge question (and I think top 20 might be stretching it, but I see Assani's point)-- but it's also definitely possible. And it's not like he, say, made a huge long stretch of assumptions to justify drafting someone many rounds earlier than most expected him to go.

And speaking of that, I discovered that a fun little exercise is to try to project HSP's draft picks in order to give him the most dysfunctional team imaginable. Try it! It's fun!

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05-20-2008 , 06:31 PM

#5311

Mano

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Quote:

Originally Posted by Victor

using assanis argument, bynum is a great pick too.

2.5 years playing at an elite level is a little more compelling than .25 years.

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05-20-2008 , 06:38 PM

#5312

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

This draft would be interesting if you got to pick a player and get their clone at their peak (forever), who is incapable of being injured (make another clone obv), and see how that changes things. Obv you'd have to redraft entirely on this rule but at least there is no grey area.

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05-20-2008 , 06:41 PM

#5313

capone0

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Quote:

Originally Posted by vixticator

I guess we could start a draft like that after this is done but we're only what 1/4th done. Some guys had some sick ass peaks. Moncrief, Hill, Penny woudl definitely go significantly higher.

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05-20-2008 , 06:43 PM

#5314

vixticator

clutch

Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 117,339

Quote:

Originally Posted by capone0

I guess we could start a draft like that after this is done but we're only what 1/4th done. Some guys had some sick ass peaks. Moncrief, Hill, Penny woudl definitely go significantly higher.

Should just do an NFL draft of post-1980 indestructable clone armies imo in a few months, heh

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05-20-2008 , 06:46 PM

#5315

RUFFNECK

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Join Date: Sep 2003 Posts: 1,444

I draft Michael Redd......start the hate.

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05-20-2008 , 06:48 PM

#5316

Shark Doctor

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Quote:

Originally Posted by RUFFNECK

I draft Michael Redd......start the hate.

still not that bad though - I just wanted to add this pic.

I guess I shouldve done it for the Bynum or Francis picks.

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05-20-2008 , 06:48 PM

#5317

capone0

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Quote:

Originally Posted by vixticator

Should just do an NFL draft of post-1980 indestructable clone armies imo in a few months, heh

NFL, MLB and other sports are tougher b/c there are so many more players than the NBA. We would need a time limit, also grading defensive players and lineman make the game a ton harder to judge.

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05-20-2008 , 06:50 PM

#5318

BJLTNYK

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Redd was the main other guy I was back and forthing with Richmond. Nice pick IMO.

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05-20-2008 , 06:50 PM

#5319

capone0

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Quote:

Originally Posted by RUFFNECK

I draft Michael Redd......start the hate.

You have Magic and Redd, two great offensive players but pretty horrible D imo. Redd's defensive ratings are attricious. OFfensively he's pretty damn efficient for a guard but the rest of his game is weak, I think there are better all around guards available then another pure scorer. This is going to hurt when you again don't pick for a while. Defensively you have a lot of work to do.

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05-20-2008 , 06:51 PM

#5320

Victor

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pretty good pick. redd is a great shooter and awesome scorer.

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05-20-2008 , 06:52 PM

#5321

capone0

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Quote:

Originally Posted by SHARK DOCTOR

still not that bad though - I just wanted to add this pic.

I guess I shouldve done it for the Bynum or Francis picks.

Was your 2nd guy picked or did I miss that.

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05-20-2008 , 06:52 PM

#5322

Shark Doctor

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hey Ruffneck - edit your Redd post by adding this to the bottom while you still have time...

MY TEAM SO FAR:

MAGIC
REDD

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05-20-2008 , 06:53 PM

#5323

D104

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Yea, you're going to get it for the Redd pick. Simply for the fact that there are players out there that can do exactly what he does, only better.

D

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05-20-2008 , 06:54 PM

#5324

DontRaisePlz

old hand

Join Date: Jul 2004 Posts: 1,565

I think Redd was one of the BPA, this just shows the downside of picking Magic Johnson top-5 in a reverse snake draft - as opposed to one of the elite centers.

there are some high risk athletes who could offer both offense and defense that might've been reaches, but would compliment Magic better IMO.

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05-20-2008 , 06:54 PM

#5325

Shark Doctor

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Quote:

Originally Posted by capone0

Was your 2nd guy picked or did I miss that.

No - I wasnt targeting Redd...I just dont like the pick all that much...especially pairing him with Magic (doesnt really make the most sense imo)

I dont think its turrible...but if i were him I wouldve targeted another type of player..thats all.

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