http://sports.yahoo.com/nba/blog/bal...urn=nba-172810

i stopped right here. do college coaches know something i dont in regards to 2 for 1 opportunities? bc they appeared strictly verboten throughout the tourney.

also, twice i saw the most idiotic strategy decision ever witnessed in a hoops game. it happened with sdsu and later kentucky. with about 50s left in the game sdsu was down a few points and the after some time ran off the shot clock they intentionally fouled. but their opponent was not in the bonus. so the shot clock reset, and now they elected to play defense rather than fouling again and going into the 1 and 1.

kentucky (i think, mebbe it was someone else) did the same against uconn.

Of course its not as fundamentally sound as the NBA, but the fact that Uconn(a team not projected to be in the top 3) actually won makes CBB more interesting for me.

Im not gonna watch 80+ games of the NBA to see the lakers or the celtics win again

They don't have the time for the passing it would take.

Last I knew, the Wildcat has a pretty good success rate in the NFL. They don't run the option due to investments made in personnel being higher.

MT2R,

The NBA shot clock isn't 9 seconds

In fairness, there are 345 teams in ncaab iirc.
UConn wasn't preseason top 25, but around 35 iirc. That puts them about 90th percentile coming into the year. This would be equivalent to the team predicted 3rd or 4th best in the NBA winning it all, which I believe happens on a regular basis without looking it up.

0:49 DeAndre Liggins missed Free Throw. 52-54
0:49 52-54 Jeremy Lamb Defensive Rebound.
0:41 Foul on Doron Lamb 52-54
0:18 52-54 Shabazz Napier Turnover.
0:18 Brandon Knight Steal. 52-54
0:16 Kentucky Full Timeout.

see, lamb fouls at 41s, after 8s had already run off the clock. so the shot clock resets. just amazing idiocy.

1:27 68-64 D.J. Gay missed Three Point Jumper.
1:21 Jeremy Lamb Defensive Rebound. 68-64
1:02 68-64 Foul on Chase Tapley
1:02 San Diego State Full Timeout.
0:34 Kemba Walker missed Jumper. 68-64

this one was even moar egregious. 19s run off the clock and then sdsu fouls. sdsu happily uses up another full shot clock.

and you are really gunna try to say that college coaches are expert at choosing the optimal strategies?

Beating somebody 1 on 1 off the dribble or 2v2 via pick and roll is the easiest way for an offense to score if they have anyone who is actually capable of doing it. Motion offenses are essentially saying that a team does not have anyone who can and needs to grind out a small edge multiple times in a possession to get a decent shot. CBB can't run NBA schemes because the vast majority of the players simply are not good enough to do it.

And even in NBA isos and pick and rolls you would have to be crazy to think that there aren't designed schemes and places for all the players on the court.

and this isn't just by a random college coach, it's by one of the highly regarded ones

there is a reason for this, and it comes from the context of the overall game.

During the entire game, college coaches often preach, preach, preach to their players to make sure they take the time to get the good look. Usually, it takes a bit more time to get a good look. College coaches are bad at math (like every coach in every sport about who look at stat and gaming nerds like we are nuts). They don't want to mess with their players overall, optimal big-game strategy to make the difference in these 2-for-1s where most coaches are not sold on the math.

Just like going for it more on 4th downs, the issue is educating coaches and then having them think the trade-off is worth it to have their players get off a shot whether the look is good or bad at the right time.

FTR, SDST was not trying to foul there as a team. The specific player assumed they were and ****ed up.

This doesn't make sense to me as the talent gap at college should be and is wider. Thus, the better players, even if they execute the pick-and-roll worse than NBA teams, has the same chance of succeeding based on worse defenders.

Colleges frequently run the pick-and-roll 2-man game up top and then are able to switch to an entirely different scheme and still get off a good shot in the half-court offense if the defense happens to defend the pick-and-roll.

And, I'm aware the other players in the NBA are doing something. They are often just spacing the court as an optimal solution based on their shooting skill and the restrictions on defensive players. I find it to be kind of a yawn.

This x1000000

People like the NCAA tournament for the excitement/variance fest. The NBA has better players. No ****. No one cares if only X amount of players from a college team will go to the NBA. People want to be entertained.

The NBA is so top heavy it's ridiculous.

This.

It worked spectacularly well for the Dolphins against the Pats in 2008, and everyone went nuts about it, but the wildcat is a joke now. Defenses caught up quickly and are too fast and complex for it to be anything more than gimmick unless they are using some GOAT personnel for it. They don't run the option because defenses are too big and too fast for it to be effective in the NFL. But you're right that a franchise QB is too important to be vulnerable to be laid out on a block.

so many irrelevant teams in CBB that you can't use the 345 #. there are about ~100 relevant teams...50 which probably have some sort of shot at a title to start the year off....10 to 15 with a legitimate shot.

the ypp and success rates say that the wildcat is still kicking ass.

Source on the wildcat stuff? How often it is run is also a major sticking point.

while the NBA is the most top heavy, football and especially baseball are pretty damn close. How many non top teams win the title in football/baseball? it's prob only slightly moar common than in basketball (especially baseball, football is a little moar variance filled but still the top teams almost always win the super bowl)

and yes I realize the giants won in baseball last year, it's still rare that it happens. teams have won in the NBA that weren't expected to either (pistons, rockets, and even the heat when they won etc)

this exactly. it can be great if you dont use it very often and you catch a team in coverage but if the usage is higher its so easy for defenses to stack the box and make it ineffective. I thought the wildcat died off last year, I know the dolphins rarely did it and if the stats show that wildcats plays have yielded similar yards a carry or something its most likely because the usage was low.

Err that's a bit of a stretch. That would make the Lakers equal to the top 11 or so teams

Re: the defenses being good. I disagree. It's easier to play D in college because so many of the opposing team's offensive players are useless (e.g. a lot of SF-C simply can't shoot or dribble effectively, lot of G can't beat their guy off the dribble).

While I was watching Butler play UConn's PnR, the big would often hedge for way too long, letting the UConn big role right to the basket unguarded. Whoever had the ball for UConn, often Kemba, was not good enough or lacked the recognition to make the pass or at least swing the ball for someone else to make the pass. Butler's big would then slowly amble back to whoever he was supposed to be guarding.

Similarly, that German freshman guy for UConn was left wide open on the baseline in the midrange area and rarely received the pass. One time he got the ball he made a nice feed to the UConn C who then fumbled it (out of bounds, IIRC, but in any case ****ed up an easy dunk). Another time he got the ball handed off to him coming down the baseline but was clearly unable to do anything with it and got bailed out on a stupid foul.

Likewise, UConn played nice D but Butler's guards were completely useless coming off screens all game. For whatever reason, Butler never made the adjustment of attacking the baseline, and I saw maybe a handful of times all game that their guards even attempted to attack the paint. Howard would set a screen, the guard would dribble around the perimeter, unable to get anywhere. Then he might either pass it around the perimeter to another guard who would repeat that abortion, or would pass it back to Howard who would try a horrible shot fake and then pass it back. Sorry, that's not good D, it's just lack of offensive talent. And, quite frankly, some very poor offensive scheming. Don't know why they rarely utilized off the ball screens to get players rolling towards the basket and rarely swung the ball hard around the perimeter to try to get better angles into the paint. It was disgusting.

If you want to watch good D, watch just about any elite NBA team. See how they hedge on the PnR, watch their rotations. These guys are long, athletic, and strong. And they have to play better schemes because they can't leave half of the opposing team open. College kids might be trying harder relative to their skill level on a more regular basis, but the best players in the NBA play their hearts out at a much higher level, particularly against elite competition. It's simply a better product. The advantages of college ball are what aejones listed, and I won't deny them. I loved the UIllinois team and their comeback against Arizona is the second best game I've ever watched (Boston > LAL game 6 obviously greatest). I'll still watch March Madness even though I don't give a **** about college ball at all. But let's not pretend it's a great game, fundamentals, schemes, defense, or any nonsense like that.

this, watching the top 5-10 nba defenses is really fun

I have no stats to back this up but watching games leads me to believe that nba defenders get beat or blown by far more often than college ones.

a Look at who has won in the NFL (SB) the last 31 years....it's much more of a variance fest than the NBA who has had:

NBA (8 different):
Lakers x 10
Bulls x 6
Celtics x 4
Spurs x 4
Pistons x 3
Rockets x 2
Heat x 1
6ers x 1
NFL (13 different):

49ers x 5
Pats x 3
Skins x 3
Giants x 3
Packers x 2
Steelers x 2
Broncos x 2
Saints x 1
Colts x 1
Bears x 1
Raiders x 1
Ravens x 1
Rams x 1

The variance in SB teams appearances in the NFL is much greater than NBA as well.

NFL (24):

Pats 6
9ers 5
Broncos: 5
Steelers 3
Packers 3
Cowboys 3
Skins 3
Giants 4
Bucs 1
Saints 1
Colts 2
Bears 2
raiders 2
Ravens 1
Cards 1
Bills 4
Seahawks 1
Falcons 1
Chargers 1
Titans 1
Eagles 2
Dolphins 2
Bengals 2
Panthers 1

NBA (18):

Lakers 16
Celtics 7
Bulls 6
Spurs 4
Pistons 4
Rockets 3
6ers 3
Magic 2
Nets 2
Jazz 2
Knicks 2
Blazers 2
heat 1
Mavs 1
Cavs 1
Indy 1
Suns 1
Sonics 1

#s could be off did them by hand.

....

almost all those teams were elite teams in the league when they won. also i'm not arguing that there isn't moar variance in football/baseball than in basketball, point is it's not that much moar

I really don't see why people care about this. I spend more time watching college than NBA and I don't feel the need to justify it to others. If you prefer the NBA and think college basketball is boring/poorly played, then don't ****ing watch it and let those of us who enjoy discuss out without trolling. Seems pretty simple to me.