I'm a fairly beginner player with lots or background in poker and a fair amount in computer science. today i was one tabling 5c/10c on 2 different occasions when my aces and kings were cracked strangely.

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1980417

http://www.pokerhand.org/?1981580

I understand it's possible for the first guy to put me on 77 or something and be pot commited to call. And i understand the second guy could be trying to steal my bet even though i had only raised ~16% preflop before that. But both these two morons got me thinking, about that AP scandal, and that i think it's possible to create a program to predict future cards (the cards of other players and the board).

If someone were to datamine a huge number of hands, and had some knowledge in random number generators i think a program wouldnt be that hard to create.

As i know it all computer based random number generators are not actually random, they are a complicated algorithm that sooner or later loops. If thats true, why is it not possible for someone to create this RNG copier to predict a poker sites hands.

PS i would guess it would be based on the hand # and or date being part of the input

Your post reveals that you don't understand how the RNGs at reputable sites are seeded.

At the leading sites, the sites use user input (mouse movements, keystrokes) to contribute towards generating a random seed number.


That random number is then used to randomly seed a RNG that generates the whole deck.

if that's true then you're right, it would be almost impossible. You would need to see the original RNG program code which i assume is only available to the creators.

so when u got AA and it holds up, try to take same amount to time and move mouse exactly the same way. that way it wont get cracked.. easy solution.
and if u manage to get it EXACTLY right, he will have KK every time u got AA... win win for u....

1) Even if you saw the original RNG code, you still wouldn't be able to crack it, because you won't know the random numbers generated by the user input (and the other half of the seed number comes from the temperature of a PC processor)

2) Trying to move your mouse in a particular way (at reputable sites) won't work because:
a) the deck is already shuffled and set before dealing begins
b) other player's actions also input on the RNG generation

im gonna go do some research on this, because now that ur starting with 'PC processor' stuff i'm starting not to b leev u. Why would they need to use all this extra information that just slows down the program. If the RNG is as complex as you say, the addition of probing for processor temperature is going to be completely useless, it would make no difference in randomness.

ok, here's a better explanation from stars that covers it in depth: http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...7&postcount=10

you can read the whole thread at http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...ad.php?t=25018

btw, i was wrong about my earlier comments about a truly random number then generating a seed number. At pokerstars at least, they do not use a seed number in the process at all.

ya, you are dead on for poker stars, it seems like a extensively slow process...but i guess they know what they're doing...party on the other hand ,doesn't seem to have such a nice RNG...im not sure how the links go on 2+2 but its the main party poker site plus /about_us/game_fairness/r_n_g.html
after reading the poker stars one, that one seems real weak...but if it is truly entropic, then it is impossible to analyze outside the system...so now i have to convince myself of another scam that made me lose to those 2 nasty monster-crackers

PS. a funny video to check out is on the PokerRNG software website, look for the demonstration of the product...notice ur only allowed to know a guess at the 'one of the suits' and only some of the board cards and only 1 persons hand...i assume they do that to make it seem more possible, but to me it seems less possible like that.

fold preflop

Don't waste your money on PokerRNG. I have a cousin who has some money tied up in a Nigerian bank. If you just send him $100, he'll make you insta-rich.

with AA or KK?