the only thing stopping me from buying pt/hm is that postgresql garbage, I hate it so much and it makes me quite upset, is there another program that basically does the same thing without it?

what is your problem with postgresql? quite easy to install when you can read and understand

You can run PT2 without postgresql, although it's faster if you choose to use it.

HEM is so much better though. I had no problems setting it up, and it's such nice software it's probably worth a little strife.

I don't like it, it runs like 10 processes and is essentially a virtual server, it also slows down my computer, it also conflicts with a lot of other stuff; I hated postgresql before it even started being introduced to poker software.

I have PT2 but unfortunately it won't import hands cause of new updates.

I think the last time I looked that open source tracker written in python used MySQL, although your hatred of postgre seems a little overblown considering it works great for so many of us.

look, it doesn't matter whether you think postgresql is good or not, nothing you say is going to change my mind. I just want to know if there's a good PT-like program that doesn't use it, and preferably doesn't need to use a virtual server.

no need to get hostile and yw for the advice.

haha I wasn't hostile bro, I'm just upset that neither PT3 nor HEM give you the option of not using postgrebage, cause otherwise I'd buy it.

you should ask the PT and HEM people why they chose postgres and I bet they all tell you that it was faster than the other options available.

Anyways as I said check out the free tracker, as I think that is the only option available to you at this point.

pat (pt2) originally intended to use mysql when looking at access alternatives but there were licensing issues he had problems with so went with pgsql (iirc a mysql-based pt2 was already underway when he dropped it); whether pt3 and hem stuck with pgsql because of pt2 users obv only they could say.

I tested a bunch of different DB engines. SQL Server was the best but the free version has a 4GB maximum DB size so it wasn't practical. SQLite was really good until it got to about 1 million hands (almost matching postgresql up until then) and then performance dropped very quickly. I also tried a few lesser known engines. Postgresql was the best overall by quite a margin.

rvg

what's the name of it? cause you only said "free open source tracker"

http://www.google.com/search?client=...utf-8&oe=utf-8

Used to run PT2/PAHUD on a crappy old celeron with 640mb ram. Ran much faster with postgres than without and I could 16 table stars ok.

What about pokeroffice? That use postgres?

Pokeroffice 2 used MySQL

Can use PT2 with Acces Databases.

You could also use a remote pgsql server on a side machine if you don't like it running processes on your machine. All in all, it's simply not possible to have big databases without a database server.

My tracker was using SQL Compact (a file based version of SQL Server) until I realized it couldn't scale so well. Access, the other file based db, doesn't scale at all.
So what's left? Big database systems. Accept it or don't use trackers.

I completely side with the OP. Of course he's pretty upset about it, but it's complete nonsense that the main trackers can't deal with, what, more than 100K hands without needing to rely on a SQL DB engine.

Most poker players have better things to do than install, maintain and upgrade SQL database.

Note that I said "most", not all. A lot people who absolutely need PT or HEM go trough the trouble of installing and configuring Postgres but it's not a proof that Postgres is easy to install.

I'm a professionnal software programmer. I know how to install Postgres (or MySQL or you-name-it). But as a software programmer I find it very disturbing that some software vendors are forcing you to install a DB engine so that you can use their software.

Just look at the gigantic amount of post either here, on the PT forums, on the HEM forums, etc. about Postgres problems. It just never stops. You can't deny it.

And once it's installed, you still have to maintain it, to "purge" it, etc. Are these people poker players or "DBAs" (Database Administrator) ?

I just can't imagine how many people are simply giving up on their HEM trial because of the archi-complicated Postgres setup (there are sooo many things that can go wrong, from Vista permissions problem to mistake to firewall issues, etc. that I just don't know where to start).

I'm not saying it: users in the forums are saying it.

In addition to that Postgres is a memory pig, a resource hog, etc. It's a friggin' database made to handle a ****load of data, but this is server side stuff. For people having several computers it can be ok (have Postgres on one comp), but these are power users.

Normal desktop user should not have this kind of monster program (Postgres) installed (and running) on their system. Have you looked at the CPU and memory (and virtual memory) usage of these pigs?

This should not be stuff you force upon the users of your software.

I agree with lots of your points. It probably would have been a good idea to put an abstraction layer between HM and the DB and then include SQLite and use it as the default option, but also have the option to run with postgres

I'll use SQL Compact, or SQL lite, and see how it works with trial version of HEM or PT3, and tell you how it goes, thanks for info for everyone who posted in the thread.

Those wont work with HM/PT3. If you want to use one of those trackers you must use PostgreSQL.

I have a quadcore intel processor, 8800GTX video card, 4GB of memory, I don't need a new PC, I just really hate postgrebage and ive hated it long before it was used on poker software.

Suck it up, Buttercup.