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plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r?

09-25-2013 , 11:01 PM
Not sure if I'm defending SB too much vs. really wide limpers.

reads (note that I don't use a HUD):

BB had just sat down and was limping or min. raising anything pre. and betting pot horrifically wide post and getting to showdown.

UTG I've seen a decent amount before and will limp wide pre. Although will raise good hands. Likes to call post. Recently got "lucky" a couple of times and is doing well.

UTG+1 dito. UTG, but fairly recently min. raised UTG with AA2 and played horrifically to 3bet/call river on KKxxK vs. UTG (who had the K, shocker).

pre. flop: I assume that BB is going to check it back a huge amount of the time, worst case he'll min. raise and everyone will call. Given all that I talked myself into completing, seemed pretty close though and I'm not sure folding isn't the best plan.

flop: After limping pre. it seems really bad to fold now with the 8 straight outs and it's possible I have the best low draw, but that's much more likely if a 4 or 2 hits. Saying that I have to call with meh/bad draws or fold a lot of turns, as BB is probably never slowing down .


Merge - $0.25 PL Hi/Lo - Omaha Hi/Lo - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: 52.6 BB (VPIP: 86.36, PFR: 18.18, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 22)
Hero (SB): 100 BB
BB: 46.24 BB (VPIP: 68.75, PFR: 31.25, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 16)
UTG: 261.92 BB (VPIP: 48.12, PFR: 6.77, 3Bet Preflop: 2.10, Hands: 671)
UTG+1: 45.28 BB (VPIP: 43.68, PFR: 13.79, 3Bet Preflop: 3.85, Hands: 87)
MP: 75.44 BB (VPIP: 39.02, PFR: 0.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 41)
MP+1: 101.96 BB (VPIP: 21.82, PFR: 7.27, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 165)
CO: 38.6 BB (VPIP: 24.90, PFR: 0.40, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 251)

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A K 6 7

UTG calls 1 BB, UTG+1 calls 1 BB, fold, fold, fold, BTN calls 1 BB, Hero calls 0.6 BB, BB checks

Flop: (5 BB, 5 players) 3 5 9
Hero checks, BB bets 5 BB, UTG calls 5 BB, fold, fold, Hero ???

Spoiler:
Hero calls 5 BB

Turn: (20 BB, 3 players) 8
Hero checks, BB bets 20 BB, UTG calls 20 BB, Hero raises to 94 BB and is all-in, BB calls 20.24 BB and is all-in, UTG calls 74 BB

River: (248.24 BB, 3 players) A

Hero shows A K 6 7 (High: Straight, Nine High, Low: 7653A) (Pre 38%, Flop 34%, Turn 49%)
BB shows 8 Q 9 7 (High: Two Pair, Nines and Eights, Low: 8753A) (Pre 22%, Flop 23%, Turn 8%)
UTG shows A J 2 J (High: One Pair, Aces, Low: 8532A) (Pre 40%, Flop 44%, Turn 43%)
Hero wins 66.44 BB
Hero wins 66.44 BB
Hero wins 50.8 BB
Hero wins 50.76 BB

...I assume turn action looks the most std. ... I have the nut high and am super likely to be freerolling, and have a good chance of having the best low already. BB is never folding, UTG is likely to think I'd do this with at least most A2 hands if he's thinking at all and likes to call anyway.
The only "downside" is that I never have air on the turn, against these villains ... but, meh. they probably don't think about that anyway.
plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? Quote
09-26-2013 , 03:13 AM
Pre is fine, although folding is ok too imo. No idea what you are seeing on the flop. Folding is obvious, no matter how the villains play.
plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? Quote
09-26-2013 , 05:14 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by illiterat
Not sure if I'm defending SB too much vs. really wide limpers.
in general, I don't think you should defend your small blind at all.

Quote:
reads

BB had just sat down and was limping or min. raising anything pre. and betting pot horrifically wide post and getting to showdown.

UTG I've seen a decent amount before and will limp wide pre. Although will raise good hands. Likes to call post. Recently got "lucky" a couple of times and is doing well.

pre. flop: I assume that BB is going to check it back a huge amount of the time, worst case he'll min. raise and everyone will call. Given all that I talked myself into completing, seemed pretty close though and I'm not sure folding isn't the best plan.
I think it's close.

Your starting hand, A K 6 7, seems OK to me for seeing the flop if you had position, but but as small blind, you're out of position, acting first, a distinct disadvantage in pot-limit.

But I can understand taking a chance on seeing the flop cheaply if you think there's a good chance BB won't raise.

Quote:
flop: After limping pre. it seems really bad to fold now with the 8 straight outs and it's possible I have the best low draw, but that's much more likely if a 4 or 2 hits. Saying that I have to call with meh/bad draws or fold a lot of turns, as BB is probably never slowing down .
I don't think it matters that you took a chance and called before the flop. In other words, I don't think calling before the flop is a reason for continuing after the flop.

However, you do have those eight nut straight outs, and I'd give your hand one more out for the back-door diamond draw, nine outs in all, maybe something like roughly half of them for half the pot. So if half your outs are for half the pot at about 1:1, and the other half are for the whole pot at 3:1, roughly your pot odds average 2:1 for this second round bet. Then if BB bets again on the next round and UTG calls again, you'll be getting the same for the next round.

So projecting, it looks like you might be getting 2:1 odds to see the next two cards. And with 9 outs, you'll make your hand in the next two cards 360/990 and miss 630/990.
630/360=7/4.

I think you're getting 8:4 (plus implied) pot odds while the odds against you are only 7:4. When your implied pot odds are better than than the odds against making your hand, then you have favorable odds.

Quote:
Merge - $0.25 PL Hi/Lo - Omaha Hi/Lo - 8 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

Hero (SB): 100 BB
BB: 46.24 BB (VPIP: 68.75, PFR: 31.25, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 16)
UTG: 261.92 BB (VPIP: 48.12, PFR: 6.77, 3Bet Preflop: 2.10, Hands: 671)

Hero posts SB 0.4 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.4 BB) Hero has A K 6 7

UTG calls 1 BB, UTG+1 calls 1 BB, fold, fold, fold, BTN calls 1 BB, Hero calls 0.6 BB, BB checks

Flop: (5 BB, 5 players) 3 5 9
Hero checks, BB bets 5 BB, UTG calls 5 BB, fold, fold, Hero ???
Call. I think you have favorable odds to call.

Buzz
plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? Quote
09-26-2013 , 08:14 AM
call pre is completely standard with those pot odds; you are pretty much just looking to flop a pretty nutted hand or else get out cheap though...your post-flop line is just going to lead you to losing a bunch of money in the long run...even if you hit your gutshot you have virtually zero chance of having the best low and, generally, we want to be looking for hands to scoop with (ie with this kinda hand a high flop wth diamonds)...I think folding pre isnt terrible given your positional disadvantage but would be very nitty.
plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? Quote
10-01-2013 , 02:51 AM
easy call pre

easy fold flop

if everyone has deep stacks calling becomes more attractive but the most likely outcome of calling is us making another questionable call on the turn
plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? Quote
10-02-2013 , 07:58 PM
Interesting ... so everyone is playing for just 543 flops (and we should be getting freerolled there if money goes in) or QJTdd/KHd7d flops? 2 pair values were mentioned but I'm not sure how much I like calling even on AK6 and all the other ones are pretty low.
plo8: Limping AdKd76d in SB vs. 3 50%ers? Calling on 953r? Quote

      
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