Right here in America...... unfortunatley we keep moving back to what originally did not work and left people starving

http://freedomkeys.com/thanksgiving.htm

William Bradford was the governor of the original Pilgrim colony, founded at Plymouth in 1621. The colony was first organized on a communal basis, as their financiers required. Land was owned in common. The Pilgrims farmed communally, too, following the "from each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs" precept.

The results were disastrous. Communism didn't work any better 400 years ago than it does today. By 1623, the colony had suffered serious losses. Starvation was imminent.

Bradford realized that the communal system encouraged and rewarded waste and laziness and inefficiency, and destroyed individual initiative. Desperate, he abolished it. He distributed private plots of land among the surviving Pilgrims, encouraging them to plant early and farm as individuals, not collectively.

The results: a bountiful early harvest that saved the colonies. After the harvest, the Pilgrims celebrated with a day of Thanksgiving -- on August 9th.

Unfortunately, William Bradford's diaries -- in which he recorded the failure of the collectivist system and the triumph of private enterprise -- were lost for many years. When Thanksgiving was later made a national holiday, the present November date was chosen. And the lesson the Pilgrims so painfully learned was, alas, not made a part of the holiday.

We don't have an example. What we have is a within a relatively short period of time, an economic model that every time it's moved further and further towards de-regulation it's come to the brink of collapse, and socialistic principles have had to save it.

What resources exhibit this behavior? That question leads me to believe you don't philosophically understand capitalism.

I think you're a little confused by your monopoly statement. Capitalism will always lead to monopolies. Communism by definition is the antithesis of Capitalism with the mean being socialism.

Philosophically, this is basically what it comes down to - You can either believe that a free market will create monopolies and you will "vote" with your dollar about how these monopolies function, or you create a system that distributes it's resources to the whole of society to benefit the whole because of the interconnection that exists between all humans, and you vote through a democracy to effect the policies, and how those resources get allocated.

The propaganda machine has spent a lot of time and money trying to confuse you about the meaning of socialism, and from what I can tell, get you to believe that it's a system that's basically looking to control your life. I'd invite you to actually read some of the philosophy and critically think about the real implications of capitalism and free markets long term on the health of our collective psyche, and the planet.

FYP

I really don't know what else to say and it's generally pretty useless even trying if you really believe what you post.

I'm hoping this is just a level by an editor of dailykos.

Plus, i think you are confusing free market capitalism and corporatism. (Yeah I couldn't resist.)

Except that communism isn't great on paper.

I'd invite you to actually read some of the philosophy and critically think about the real implications of capitalism and free markets long term on the health of our collective psyche, and the planet.

Hope that author kept his royalties for the book. It would have been nice if Chavez gave an English version of the book. Chavez is hilarious, he has been railing against Obama for the last month or so and now you can tell he just really wanted to meet him. I'm sure the last 8 years of snubs by President Bush really hurt his feelings.

It does not surprise me that you won't read a book.

And you shouldn't assume.

You've lost all credibility.

Yes Mr. Ballin I have (were you out there tea baggin for life?).

My degree is in philosophy. I've read every major spiritual and classical philosophical work that has been printed.

I wouldn't even try and bring this discussion into the spiritual realm of how capitalism's reduction of everything into material goods to be exploited enslaves our minds. I'd just be ridiculed. Oh wait, I think I will be now.

The reason being is because you already know. However, you'll do everything in your psyche's ability to block and deny that capitalism's effects of exploiting other people, and the resources of the world come at a cost. You'll justify it, get angry about it, and bond together with others who currently can't see beyond their own self interest to validate your position... but you know. You are smarter than that on a deeper aspect if your self you've probably had some glimpses of.

Resorting to personal insults now? I would expect more from someone as well read as yourself.

I read The Audacity of Hope
I did not find it hopeful

:shrugs:

so plz explain to us stupid people how a system that advocates the destruction of capitalism, glorifies collectivism and states control of the means of production is anything but socialist.

Medieval Iceland and the Absence of Government

It isn't exactly AC land but a good example of the success of private justice and security.

Proof of free market capitalism in the US, let alone it causing the housing crisis, GD, etc.? Is calling what we have in the US a mixed corporatist/welfare state system which is deep in debt acceptable to you?

Yes fascism is not socialism but it is statism.

Because I really want to snuggle up and read a book with you.

I will promise to read whatever book you choose, as long as it is free online, if you read Socialism by Ludwig von Mises.

Note for others: Mises uses the word "liberal" throughout his writing as in "classical liberal" the predecessor of libertarianism, not modern liberals or social democrats.

I don't think you're stupid btw, far from it. What I think is that you were indoctrinated into a system that can only exist by convincing it's members to act against their own interest by appealing to the most destructive/constructive (a little Taoism there) aspect of the self - your ego. The ego is only an aspect of the self.

Like Plato's allegory of the cave, at some point you're going to turn around and see the source of the shadows on the caves of the wall.

Tsao > Tao IMO

I am not "indoctrinated" into anything, I simply wish to live my life as I see fit without fear of being attacked by your government for it.

yes but self is all we have. I am all I know and all I ever will know. Self ownership and freedom of association are the most import of all rights.

they all look he same to me

This thread needs less calling people ignorant IMO.

Published in 1975, heh. Has anybody read the book? No kindle edition, so I won't.

Would it be possible for you to cram any more appeals to authority in your future posts?

You don't need to personify me into the government. You make a lot of assumptions. And I'd assume because if someone is a liberal thinker, that means that they must stand for government?

You're confusing terms a bit. Your ego is being fed constantly in the system you were born into, and your mind is being starved (no offense meant here, I mean this for everyone including me). Your ego is necessary for this existence, but it is only one aspect of your true SELF.

There is much to know beyond your limited self. You are likely one up on most people if you know your self though. Good job.

I'm not trying to be mean on condescending here.....

Based on your posts you come across as one of the most indoctrinated people who have posted on this board. The scary thing, is that you think everyone else is the one that has been fooled by the "propaganda" of one ideology or another, while in your mind you ideology is near flawless.

It's as if you are chastising people for being members of the Nazi party while wearing the robes of the KKK.

Even if what he says is loltastic, can you guys just stop trolling him for a bit so we can discuss? ty

Let's learn instead of fighting. I think we have a genuine believer in socialism here and it is a rare opportunity.

freak, can you say whether this is a true statement of your beliefs?

It kind of sounds like you're confusing indoctrination with analogous. I understand what you're trying to get at though. However, if everything isn't relative, then there are better opinions than others.

Do you understand what McCarythism was about?

When I was in my early twenties I spent a good amount of time meditating in the mountains, and meeting some of the greatest spiritual teachers of our time. The goal was to free my mind, which I did....

Would you like to continue to make this personal though?

I'm not a socialist.

No, I can't because that is not an accurate interpretation of Marxism.

Interesting that you cite Taoism, a fundamentally libertarian ideology.

"The best governors do not govern."

From a spiritual perspective, I don't see how you could be satisfied with a political system that is based on force.