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Who will run against Trump in 2020? Who will run against Trump in 2020?

02-22-2019 , 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
fyi I ain't voting for Biden or Sanders
Are you talking about the primary or a 1v1 vs Trump?
02-22-2019 , 04:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by eyebooger
Are you talking about the primary or a 1v1 vs Trump?
Obviously primaries in this context.
02-22-2019 , 04:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
Lol. You'll just yell rigged like last time when he loses and whine about "centrists" and black voters not supporting him.

Meanwhile, policies that are labeled progressive are supported by a wider array of candidates and liberals in general.
This feels like you're arguing that Dems nominated the correct candidate in 2016. I could be reading it wrong.
02-22-2019 , 05:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
You want to look at 2016 numbers of what actual turnout and votes looked like amongst black voters?

Bernie has problems there and it's silly to dismiss them.
o wow Bernie did poorly among older black woman when running against a candidate whose background was a perfect fit for getting that vote.

Bernie won younger black people despite that disadvantage. He probably won't crush this demographic in the primaries against some like Copmala, and the primaries will be a tough battle. But in the general this is not an issue. The states where Hillary truly crushed Bernie are all auto-red southern states. Bernie will do fine with black turnout in the general in the swing states. And he's the perfect Dem candidate to get the white vote in those swing states (which he did well in the primary vs Hillary) that corpoHillary managed to lose to a reality show TV host.
02-22-2019 , 05:01 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
Obviously primaries in this context.
u allin team klobuchar?
02-22-2019 , 05:07 PM
Love how ppl posted multiple recent polls showing Bernie is the most popular candidate among POCs and noted that "Bernie has a problem with black voters" is a false narrative, only for Paul D to stumble in to remind us that "Sanders is already starting out with a disadvantage with POC."


Like, if the narrative is Bernie needs to improve his #s with POC voters based on the 2016 primary results, sure, I can understand that. Except, multiple recent polls show that... he is the most popular candidate among POC voters, now, so clearly he no longer "has a disadvantage." If you want to claim that poll #s don't translate into votes, I can accept that, except that's moving the goalposts.
02-22-2019 , 05:14 PM
A lot of the favorability ratings are just name recognition, but it was encouraging that even *adjusting* (supposedly) for name recognition Bernie came out on top in the most recent ones.
02-22-2019 , 05:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nonfiction
Love how ppl posted multiple recent polls showing Bernie is the most popular candidate among POCs and noted that "Bernie has a problem with black voters" is a false narrative, only for Paul D to stumble in to remind us that "Sanders is already starting out with a disadvantage with POC."


Like, if the narrative is Bernie needs to improve his #s with POC voters based on the 2016 primary results, sure, I can understand that. Except, multiple recent polls show that... he is the most popular candidate among POC voters, now, so clearly he no longer "has a disadvantage." If you want to claim that poll #s don't translate into votes, I can accept that, except that's moving the goalposts.
Except I'm like not the only person who thinks Sanders is starting off with an uphill climb when it comes to black voters. There's been a number of African American journalists who have addressed this issue in the recent past. If you google right now there's one in WaPo a few days ago (I know lol WaPo and all, but they hold more influence than you 2p2ers berniebros).

What's more telling is you guys stick to one thing that is in your favor than actually searching out the issue because god forbid Bernie isn't Jesus Walking on Water.
02-22-2019 , 05:28 PM
02-22-2019 , 05:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
What's more telling is you guys stick to one thing that is in your favor than actually searching out the issue because god forbid Bernie isn't Jesus Walking on Water.
...says the notably open-minded Paul D, while actively denying that "the one thing that is in your favor" means absolutely anything at all
02-22-2019 , 05:34 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
Except I'm like not the only person who thinks Sanders is starting off with an uphill climb when it comes to black voters. There's been a number of African American journalists who have addressed this issue in the recent past. If you google right now there's one in WaPo a few days ago (I know lol WaPo and all, but they hold more influence than you 2p2ers berniebros).

What's more telling is you guys stick to one thing that is in your favor than actually searching out the issue because god forbid Bernie isn't Jesus Walking on Water.
Breaking news, establishment journalists who are in the same social circles as establishment politicians and who maintain their access through favorable coverage of establishment politicians write negative articles on opponents of establishment politicians.
02-22-2019 , 05:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by goofyballer
...says the notably open-minded Paul D, while actively denying that "the one thing that is in your favor" means absolutely anything at all
Oh please, if anyone else says anything bad about Bernie you will do the same **** where you pull out a poll that doesn't account for all entrants in the race, debates, and platforms.

You copy and paste **** you agree with all the time on various topics and then try to tear down the poster instead of actually addressing there's a wider world out there than you think. You're very much on par with ikes like that, and it's a sympton of all bernie bros itt. You refuse to address all info available and clutch on stubbornly to what's in your support.

You say there's polls that show Bernie is the most favored candidate amongst POC. I say well that's not what 2016 looked like and there's actual POC who are saying Bernie has troubles. And somehow that's not reasonable? Either you're a ****ing drone like those Kremlin trolls who supported Sanders in 2016 or you're arguing in bad faith.
02-22-2019 , 05:38 PM
Kamala is a truly despicable choice. Yes I would even go Biden .
02-22-2019 , 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cuserounder
I think this is a tough claim to make. I mean, I'm not saying Kaine was a great VP choice... But is your thought that Booker gives her a boost among African-Americans? She already won the black vote by 80 points, which is pretty standard for Dems - not quite Obama levels. Going back over her short list, if I could pick anyone from the short list, my rankings would be:

1. Sherrod Brown
2. Tim Ryan
3. Cory Booker
4. Tim Kaine

Like, I think if you ran a sim out with Kaine versus any of the others on the short list, you have a better chance of winning with him than say Warren, Castro, Perez, Garcetti, Becerra, Vilsack, etc.

But given the razor-thin margins throughout the rust belt, I think going with a prominent rust belt Dem would be the strategy in hindsight. Out of people that were speculated about but never considered, Bernie, Klobuchar and Franken might all get her the win. Of course, this is Al Franken pre MeToo allegations, I'm basing this on who these people were in 2016. Obviously I wouldn't advocate for him as a VP pick now with what we know.
Why did Booker disappear? Seemed like he and Kamala had equally high profiles up until the last few months but then Kamala emerged as the frontrunner and he faded away.
02-22-2019 , 05:49 PM
Ignoring all of your glass-houses whining about posting:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
You say there's polls that show Bernie is the most favored candidate amongst POC. I say well that's not what 2016 looked like and there's actual POC who are saying Bernie has troubles.
Your problem here is that sentence 2 does not actually contradict sentence 1, but you keep acting like it does.
02-22-2019 , 05:51 PM


02-22-2019 , 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Dominic
So potentially Trump and Bernie could be left off if they faced each other. What if no one gets to 270 due to that?
02-22-2019 , 06:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Namath12
So potentially Trump and Bernie could be left off if they faced each other. What if no one gets to 270 due to that?
Look out dudes, Namath12 is sporting a massive MSNBC Joy Reid establishment twitter rage boner by bringing up Sanders tax returns. The gall of the man to only release a two-page summary -- only if he releases the entire tax return can we seriously consider Sanders.
02-22-2019 , 06:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by goofyballer
Ignoring all of your glass-houses whining about posting:



Your problem here is that sentence 2 does not actually contradict sentence 1, but you keep acting like it does.
Ignoring the fact you are revert into trying to handwave and dismiss every disagreement you have with anyone:


I'm not denying that Sanders could actually get the highest % of black voters or POC in 2020 primaries. I'm saying I'm skeptical of it. There's evidence that Sanders has issues there and this shouldn't be a problem if Sanders himself does a better job this time around.
02-22-2019 , 06:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
Ignoring the fact you are revert into trying to handwave and dismiss every disagreement you have with anyone:
I have no idea what this means, but I can tell you in general that there is little point in engaging you on anything beyond the actual substance of the argument because a.) you will go on forever given the opportunity, and b.) it's not actually useful or good for the thread to go on large derails about Who Are The Bad Politics Posters every time you want to (which is, in practice, any time you disagree with someone).

And on substance, I agree with everything you just posted, so I think we're good!
02-22-2019 , 07:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paul D
You say there's polls that show Bernie is the most favored candidate amongst POC. I say well that's not what 2016 looked like and there's actual POC who are saying Bernie has troubles. And somehow that's not reasonable? Either you're a ****ing drone like those Kremlin trolls who supported Sanders in 2016 or you're arguing in bad faith.
So all the people who were polled were not "actual POC?"

lmao

ya, def bad faith
02-22-2019 , 07:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Namath12
So potentially Trump and Bernie could be left off if they faced each other. What if no one gets to 270 due to that?
Eventually it ends up at counting # of states in favor, which Trump wins. 269-269 has multiple plausible paths even though obviously it's a very unlikely outcome. Also random castoffs causing a dem candidate to go down to 269 is well within lol dem range.
02-22-2019 , 07:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by aoFrantic
Policies that help people are a gift to Trump. I love our center right friends on here. Obama had a two year window to enact progressive policy. That window ended in 2010. If they don't do it now, you have things getting worse and the next chance being what...2028?

Revots wants the democrats to run to the right again and hope they go with their policies that will atttact suburban GOP votes.
If someone votes against govt taking control of the entire healthcare system, they don't see that as a vote against "helping people". They obviously feel it would not help THEM, or else they would vote for it. Whether it helps others is of less concern than how it impacts their own family.

Look at the conservative outrage over ACA, and that was just incremental change within a private system. Medicare for all would drive Trump turnout through the roof and alienate many moderates who already have insurance and think the system basically works well for them.
02-22-2019 , 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by revots33
If someone votes against govt taking control of the entire healthcare system, they don't see that as a vote against "helping people". They obviously feel it would not help THEM, or else they would vote for it. Whether it helps others is of less concern than how it impacts their own family.

Look at the conservative outrage over ACA, and that was just incremental change within a private system. Medicare for all would drive Trump turnout through the roof and alienate many moderates who already have insurance and think the system basically works well for them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by goofyballer
Keep making the same debunked post over and over tho.
02-22-2019 , 08:58 PM
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Originally Posted by aoFrantic
Fwiw literally double the Bernie supporters voted for Clinton in 16 than Clinton supporters voted for Obama in 08.
This can't be true. You have a cite for this?

      
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