Fair enough but what I posted was analysis done from a book written by Zawahiri based on the principals of the AQ ideology, among other things. So its not really selectively quoting, it analysis based on several pieces of information.

I understand where you are coming from though.


Here is something to read about poor/uneducated people and terrorist:

http://www.the-dissident.com/islam.shtml



That would be ideal but if your premise is based off faulty (critical) information, then it seems trivial to do so. I mean thats, basically, what everyone tells me about my stuff. Besides, I think I've addressed some of what you've said in some of my other post.

LOL I'm sure that was one of his actual reasons, gmafb.

Of course we can't understand the nuances. Not because we're stupid either. Take a specific region, or organization, to even have the slightest idea what is happening you need years and years of study. Furthermore, the POTUS doesn't understand the details. He has to weigh what the analysts tell him with other considerations, and his advisers don't even agree with one another a lot of the time. What do you think goes on?

**** is complicated. Then our decisions make it more complicated. At no point is there a person out there who knows precisely what is happening. It is not knowable. "They hate us for our freedoms," is just the result of a series of things. It doesn't necessarily mean much. It serves a certain purpose.

This guy knows something!!!! Read and learn.

Qutbism does the job better IMO.

Yeah cool links bro (ShillingShill). Not a mention of the origin of the name.

suzzer was right about astroturfers imo. I won't get more specific lest I get reprimanded for ad hominems.

Way better......my knowledge base did not go that far so did not know what to search for.

So you are pointing out a discrepancy concerning the name "Al Qaeda" which has no relevance towards the topic and quite frankly rather trivial.


Thats is about as lame as me belaboring a point about the definition of torture.

I was responding to your response. Are you just one person? Serious question.

As much as we look at thing in the aggregate it still boils down to the individual (albeit a large collection of them) It's the whole micro vs macro

Try looking at OBL and the like as a larger scale David Koresh type figure - u realize trying to make out a coherent list of motivating factors isn't going to begin with the words they say.

As I brought up before with the Jews. If you wanted you easily could make a list of real injustices that molded the persona and agenda of Hitler starting w/ the Treaty of Versailles after WWI, but to what avail?

Yea I read the spoiler. Zakahiri wants to use similar propaganda styles as the Nazis in order to garnish support for their cause (dumb it down so everyone can understand it and bring them in). He lays out the plan in his book, and it is a march to war essentially.

My question is, what is at the heart of his demands? He wants to set up a muslim state. Why can't this be solved politically? Since it seems that it can't, why is it any of our business? Only because we support Israel, which then becomes why they hate us.

So the answer seems easy, pull support our support of Israel. There's no reason we need to play favorites with them and it seems their enemies are lumping us in with them. Drawing a clear line between us and them seems to be a step in the right direction.

I think I follow you. What is the difference between "they say" and "they want"? Is it one and the same in regards to what your speaking about? Or is it different?

What about "their ideology"?

You mean beside the fact they are the ones who skipped the political avenue and continues to do so? Their goal is to politically solve the middles east and violently solve the US. That is there policy not our, ours is just response. Are you of the idea that we should placate anyone who preemptively strikes us, even though it will not solve the bigger problem or stop future attacks? Besides that whose land do you give them? You do not think those people are going to have an issue? I think we been there before.

In response to your ninja edit, wat?

You bring up the point of who created the identity of islamic extremism, and then you belittle it? JFC.

I'm sorry, it must of went over your head, I'll ignore you for now on.


EDIT:

AQ did not create the idea or identity of Islamic Extremism, it only provided the modern day name for it.

I'm saying positions of prominence aren't always attained by rational, logical men let alone sane (and if someone's not sane than what value do you put in their words?)

The skill sets aren't synonymous

Oh wow, and now you're talking about others preemptively attacking the US. Is this opposite day?

I'm going to bed. GL FF, I hope you're getting paid per post, because you're doing good work.

That's what I'm trying to say above w/ the USA too. What OBL happens to say in a video doesn't necessarily have anything to do with anything other than trying to sell the idea... I'm right, follow me. The same thing. The Declaration of Independence was really just a way of saying "alright, we're tired of you guys running ****, we're taking over, who wants in?" too. War of ideas. You shouldn't be taking what people say (especially in politics, religion) at surface value unless you enjoy being a fish.

When Osama says he's fighting for revenge on Hiroshima, it's just part of a PR campaign. Hell, maybe he thinks that is part of it. Nevertheless, it cannot be taken seriously.

To the smarter people in the room:

Has the US ever in its history ever have a proactive foreign policy or is it always a reaction to other events?

I mean, what?!? Because the world needs more Afghanistan's circa 2001, right? That was a major part of the problem to begin with man. You are so out of touch it is hard to fathom.

I hope thats not directed at me. (the bold) As I've always thought, once I learned about it (Islamic Extremist), I understood it fairly well.

If you're posting here and don't know what fish means, RigMeARiver's suspicions might be onto something.

Even if something was 'proactive' you could view it as reactionary. Everything you do is a reaction - bend the spoon moment.

Are you asking if we ever tried to be an empire builder? We didn't get to 50 states w/o what you're alluding to. They were 'foreign' till they were ours

Well you seem rather smart and savvy enough to give out a subtle insult.

Oh, I see. I'm not that clever. If that makes me clever then yeah I definitely meant it in that way.