Because the government sucks at everything but being illogical and hypocritical, ldo.

Huh? Yes when something is cheap people generally don't have to whore, rob, steal for it. When you criminalize something you artificially increase the cost of obtaining it via a black market, when the substance is addictive, it causes addicts to rob, steal, or whore to obtain it, unless they happen to wealthy like celebrities or wall street types, who then can often be functioning addicts for years even decades before ultimately seeking treatment. If it were cheap like alcohol and cigarettes, it doesn't mean it isn't harmful, it just means that the need to whore oneself to obtain it is diminished greatly. Alcohol can be very addictive and can also ruin peoples lives in short order, as your cocaine ramblings allude to, are women generally driven to whoring themselves out to pay for their alcohol addictions?

You seem to have missed my point entirely. Despite the cost ("artificially inflated" or not), a tobacco habit can only cost so much, typically 1-2 packs a day (~$5-10), whereas cocaine can cost whatever the hell you're willing to pay for it in a given night until you keel over and choke on your own vomit.

Regardless, this particular derail STILL has absolutely nothing to do with the incentivisation of prostitution via state-sponsorship.

Sigh.

hmm...it's like you don't even read my posts. You not even disagreeing with my counterarguments, you just repeating the same assertion.

I understand that people don't OD on cigs, they do on alcohol though, and what does this have to do with whoring yourself out to pay for the addiction via exorbitant black market prices? If cocaine was cheap and legal, the difference would be that a women could OD and keel over and choke on her own vomit without having to whore herself to pay for the coke in the first place.

I voted option 2 but am conflicted. For me it is definitely unethical and I wouldn't participate if it was legal, but there is no denying prostitutes provide a service to society. There is a class of male (very ugly, severely crippled, extremely socially awkward) that would have a very hard time getting laid without hookers. Thank goodness they are there as a pressure release valve, or we might see a lot more random violence.

Links to "they just like sex" posts? I don't recall anyone saying that (unless you used mod-ability to turbo delete them?)
All voluntary transactions are viewed as beneficial by the exchangers. People are not committing rape. That's just an empty emotional plea. Unless you think all prostitution is rape in a "she doesn't WANT to have sex with you, she's just doing it cuz you pay her" way.
As long as you're admitting that people wouldn't whore themselves out for cocaine if it was cheap. You seem to be arguing whether "cocaine should be legal or not" and not "would people whore themselves out for coke if it was legal".

Johns are not limited to guys that cant get laid. See Hugh Grant and many politicians.. Just a thought, it is more ethical to lie to a regular girl, with the sole pupose being to get in her pants or pay someone and go separate ways when done

Or how about Hugh Grant seeing that ugly hooker when he had Elizabeth Hurley waiting at home.

If people were doing free dentistry on each other all over the place would we condemn people who charged for it?

If there was a prostitute who always gave the money back to the John after he paid would that change the moral nature of the transaction?

I don't remember Hugh Grant. Was he:

A) Very ugly

B) Crippled

C) Socially awkward

D) All of the above?

Somewhat.

wth? Was he masturbating during that picture?

E) Sexual deviant.

I wonder what % of prostitution is forced by traffickers, pimps, or done to obtain drugs etc. If there are any estimates at all. Prostitution by itself, just a woman (or man) who is a totally willing participant I don't have any real problem with it. I am under the impression that most prostitutes are not these people though.

Well, the whole prohibition thing isn't working too well to stop sex slavery. If anything, it encourages sex slavery: the criminal nature of prostitution means that mostly those on the margins of society(drug addicts, runaways, illegal immigrants, victims of kidnapping) "accept" the risks involved.

I didn't mean to imply that all John's can't otherwise get laid...that's obviously not true. I was simply pointing out that prostitutes provide an important "service" to society that is often overlooked.

well, how many places have laws that allow people to set up a respectable prostitution business? Given that this is very rare i would wager that most prostitution operates in the ugly black markets of drug and sex peddlers and their manifestations of organized crime. That would be my guess.

Kind of like how if you were to outlaw and criminalize respectable casinos and card rooms from doing business, and then ponder how many of the ones that fill in the demand and operate in the black market are not run by organized crime, not full of shady characters, and don't have cheating, robbery and mugging as a real concern?

Even where it is legal there is widespread abuse.

Boro's posts for example in the LC thread.

But plenty of them are pretty clearly not mutually beneficial to both exchangers to any rational observer.

Rape - "the unlawful compelling of a woman through physical force or duress to have sexual intercourse. "

If the prostitutes are there due to human trafficking and sex slavery it is rape. The John might not know it, but it's rape. If she doesn't have sex with him - she gets the **** kicked out of her by her pimp or whoever in many cases.

Wouldn't it be immoral to visit a prostitute if there is even a small chance you would actually be raping her.

Really? Are the following unethical?

- Selling heroin to vulnerable people?
- Encouraging someone to buy heroin who has been trying for months to get off the stuff.
- Running out on your pregnant wife.
- Selling a gun to a clearly suicidal man.
- Incest with your 18 year old daughter?

All of these could not even be entertained as "unethical"?

And of course, like I've been saying, prostitution is often NOT voluntary.

I searched all of Boro's posts in the LC thread (I'm bored as hell working this graveyard) and the only thing that anyone could ever read as "they just like sex" is:

"Human beings like sex" means there is a demand for a prostitute's services.

And like you should have realized far earlier, that is a seperate issue.

No it's not, because you have no ****ing clue if the girl you are banging is a sex slave or not. If we're talking about prostitution in the real world, the actual issues involved with visiting a prostitute, how are you going to determine that she is there voluntarily and not through threat of violence? Asking her pimp? Asking her? Could you be certain?

It seems impossible to separate the two unless you have some way of determining who the voluntary whore are and who the involuntary slaves are.

This view of prostitutes is off in cloud-cuckoo land. I've looked at a couple other forums' debates on prostitution two and this attitude always seems to come out - many prostitutes just like sex and are healthy, well adjusted people who like their job, are good at it, and make good money at it. Like the plant Stossel was trying to make us believe is representative of prostitution, hilariously. Most prostitutes are not like that now, and I doubt most prostitutes are going to be like that if we ever have a free-market society.

May I ask what your experience with prostitution is?

Volunteered at a social services centre for a couple of years. I only worked a day or an evening or two a week, but we dealt with plenty of prostitutes looking for help, they organize data gathering on prostitution in the area and so on. I don't exactly claim to be an expert, but I know the "hooker with a heart of gold" thing is almost entirely a myth, and when it comes from some men, a very transparent rationalization of behaviour they know on some level is pretty wrong.

There are some pretty decent studies out there on the statistics of prostitution. I've linked some of them in here, so it's not too difficult to be informed on the matter.