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06-11-2008 , 06:59 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brainwalter
What about full-grown adult, consenting incest? I heard a story about a woman who had been adopted, only later to find her biological father at which time they "fell in love" and began a romantic/sexual relationship. Just wondering your stance on things like this. (not that you have to have one.)
Feel good story imo

Edit: epic related video
06-11-2008 , 07:00 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borovoselo
Homosexual behavior = homosexual?
This is the funniest post I have seen in my life. Well played sir.

Lol at the argument of ITD that legalizing gay marriage ends society. "If all society was gay it wouldn't last long." If all our future kids are born without genitals it won't last long either.

I need evidence that legalizing gay marriage will increase gay activity to the point that homosexuality is all that exists. I'm extremely pro-gay marriage, but I can't see myself being teh ghey when it becomes legal.

"Oh I can marry a dude now...**** it, I'm switching sides. Society is ov-ah!"
06-11-2008 , 07:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ikestoys
Yes? This is the general assumption that Darwinism works on.
I haven't studied much "Darwinism" but in my evolutionary biology and genetics classes we learned something very different from "our ultimate purpose is to reproduce".
06-11-2008 , 07:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jah7_fsu1
This is the funniest post I have seen in my life. Well played sir.

Lol at the argument of ITD that legalizing gay marriage ends society. "If all society was gay it wouldn't last long." If all our future kids are born without genitals it won't last long either.

I need evidence that legalizing gay marriage will increase gay activity to the point that homosexuality is all that exists. I'm extremely pro-gay marriage, but I can't see myself being teh ghey when it becomes legal.

"Oh I can marry a dude now...**** it, I'm switching sides. Society is ov-ah!"

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosex...l_explanations

Homosexuality = REAL social construct
Kids somehow born without genitals = IMAGINARY biological development
06-11-2008 , 07:04 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crzylgs
I haven't studied much "Darwinism" but in my evolutionary biology and genetics classes we learned something very different from "our ultimate purpose is to reproduce".
Successful adaptations mean more success, which means more offspring, which leads to more whatever it is with that adaptation. Implied in this, is that success breeds, er, breeding. Again, this was qualified from a purely biological basis, obviously a success in most other contexts is defined much differently.
06-11-2008 , 07:06 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by DVaut1
I want to reiterate that it's actually patently irrelevant what Bluff was trying to do, since I'm more than happy to concede that homosexuality may be the product of human will and only human will, and may have absolutely no genetic or "natural" cause outside of a conscious human decision. And that would change absolutely nothing about how I view homosexual people, and how I think the state ought to handle their desires to: 1) marry each other or, for ITD, 2) not get thrown into a concentration camp, or 3) likely any of the other hot button political issues that revolve around the rights of gay people.

I'd hate to think the debate about this should hinge upon the consensus of some scientists, lest tomorrow a group of the 10 most respected geneticists tomorrow discover that homosexual behavior is completely uncorrelated with genetics or any other "natural" or biological cause. Should that day come, my views won't change a wit, as I'd steadfastly maintain "being gay" is a completely valid choice for anyone to make, as is wanting to marry a partner of the same sex, so the question of whether or not homosexuality is a product of nature or not is not at all a question I care about.

I never intended to get myself entangled in that ridiculous debate; I just wanted to make sure the likes of borosovelo didn't get away using terrible logic to assume that homosexual behavior isn't natural. Again, I'd happily concede the actual answer to the question as to whether or not it's natural is completely irrelevant to me, but I don't think that kind of "homosexuality is unnatural, they can't reproduce!" stuff should go left unchallenged, either.
This is exactly how I feel. Whether it is "natural" or not is irrelevant. WTF does that even mean? I love drinking Dr. Pepper, is that natural? If not should I not be allowed to drink it? Is S&M by consenting hetero adults natural? Where do we draw the line? I don't need my politicians deciding what is correct for consenting adults to do in the bedroom. Soon we will all be having sex only to have kids and it is only going to be missionary.

It's just hilarious that the right wing anti-gay people are always the one getting caught giving BJ's and stuff. I think the more anti-gay you are the more likely you are to secretly be gay.

ITD...something you want to tell us?
06-11-2008 , 07:07 PM
And anyhow, this argument was more or less forced upon me, these are my personal beliefs and I have, nor have ever had, any will in changing anyone's mind. Also, to the best of my recollection, all of the counterarguments against the 'homosexual society' thing have been truly ridiculously flawed and unfair.
06-11-2008 , 07:07 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borovoselo
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosex...l_explanations

Homosexuality = REAL social construct
Kids somehow born without genitals = IMAGINARY biological development
Excellent post.

Gay marriage=everyone becomes gay...

IMAGINARY **** THAT WILL NEVER HAPPEN.

Honestly, this is the best you can do? By keeping gay marriage from happening you are saving society from all becoming gay?

"Gay marriage is horrible...imagine if everyone was gay!"

I suppose if we legalized prostitution nationally no one would have free sex again either?

Keeping something illegal forces everyone to not do it. The moment it becomes legal everyone does it.

Wow...
06-11-2008 , 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jah7_fsu1
Where do we draw the line?
There is no line, right? You should be able to do what ever you want if you are a consenting adult.
06-11-2008 , 07:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by vhawk01
Not a big fan, but it isnt wrong. You could make a fairly convincing argument that them having children is pretty brutal though.

What if they didnt realize they were father-daughter until their 10th anniversary?
wat...wat..is this the FLDS thread?
06-11-2008 , 07:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ikestoys
Successful adaptations mean more success, which means more offspring, which leads to more whatever it is with that adaptation. Implied in this, is that success breeds, er, breeding. Again, this was qualified from a purely biological basis, obviously a success in most other contexts is defined much differently.
This is a much better simplification of natural selection (at least on an organism level), but still has nothing to do with our "ultimate purpose".
06-11-2008 , 07:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crzylgs
This is a much better simplification of natural selection (at least on an organism level), but still has nothing to do with our "ultimate purpose".
Our "ultimate purpose", on a biological level, is natural selection.
06-11-2008 , 07:11 PM
Quote:
By keeping gay marriage from happening you are saving society from all becoming gay?
You mistake me for someone that's agreed with OP on even point, which I don't think I have.
06-11-2008 , 07:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jah7_fsu1
Wondering if ITD is the type of redneck that says "I support gay marriage...if both the chicks are hot!"
jah, u crack me up. You gotta look into writing for J. Stewart.
06-11-2008 , 07:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ikestoys
Our "ultimate purpose", on a biological level, is natural selection.
Does not compute.
06-11-2008 , 07:14 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by crzylgs
Does not compute.
Compute harder.
06-11-2008 , 07:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ikestoys
Our "ultimate purpose", on a biological level, is natural selection.
This makes exactly as much sense as saying that our ultimate purpose is to fulfill the Schrodinger wave equation. It's true on some level, but it's hardly helpful for policy.
06-11-2008 , 07:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bobman0330
This makes exactly as much sense as saying that our ultimate purpose is to fulfill the Schrodinger wave equation. It's true on some level, but it's hardly helpful for policy.
Well duh, I'm not arguing on policy, I'm trying to correct an error.
06-11-2008 , 07:17 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by blufish
There is no line, right? You should be able to do what ever you want if you are a consenting adult.
Strawman much?

Should a man and a woman be able to have anal sex?

Should a man and a man be able to have anal sex?

Why or why not? Cause it isn't "natural" (love to see proof it isn't)? Who decides natural?

Also why quit there?

I don't think a man and a woman should be able to spank each others asses in the bedroom.

I don't think a man should be able to go down on a woman.

I think it erodes family values when people have sex for fun and not to reproduce. I don't believe oral sex leads to children, therefore I think it should be against the law.

Seriously, if we allow gay marriage to happen what is the worst that happens? Someone has to do better than "we all turn gay!"

Does society really crumble? Really? Based on that alone?

Is it because marriage is some sacred tradition? Yeah, so sacred we have like a 53% divorce rate and you can get married in Vegas in like 5 minutes.
06-11-2008 , 07:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by ikestoys
Compute harder.
I don't think even Deep Blue could crack this one.
06-11-2008 , 07:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kurto
are you serious?

have you done a minimal amount of research?

Here's a wikipedia entry:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homosexuality_in_animals

here's an article with examples. http://www.seedmagazine.com/news/200...p?page=all&p=y

There's a book called Evolution's Rainbow which documented sexual diversity throughout the animal kingdom. Here's a review about the book Evolution's Rainbow from Publisher's Weekly


Last - I'm betting you can find youtube footage since there's a number of famous gay animals in US zoos.
Rollin. This thread has turned into serious chuckles.

Chuckling aside, you know those famous gay lobby zoo animals are "making a choice to be gay tho", amirite?
06-11-2008 , 07:21 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by jah7_fsu1
Strawman much?

Should a man and a woman be able to have anal sex?

Should a man and a man be able to have anal sex?

Why or why not? Cause it isn't "natural" (love to see proof it isn't)? Who decides natural?

Also why quit there?

I don't think a man and a woman should be able to spank each others asses in the bedroom.

I don't think a man should be able to go down on a woman.

I think it erodes family values when people have sex for fun and not to reproduce. I don't believe oral sex leads to children, therefore I think it should be against the law.

Seriously, if we allow gay marriage to happen what is the worst that happens? Someone has to do better than "we all turn gay!"

Does society really crumble? Really? Based on that alone?

Is it because marriage is some sacred tradition? Yeah, so sacred we have like a 53% divorce rate and you can get married in Vegas in like 5 minutes.

Must have touched a nerve.

I asked you a question based on what I read around here all the time. There is no line. Two consenting adults can do whatever they want, right? A question. Simple. You can bluff and bluster all you want. Just answer the simple question.
06-11-2008 , 07:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by borovoselo
Homosexual behavior = homosexual?
Masturbation = homosexual behavior?
06-11-2008 , 07:24 PM
Any organism is as such due to the reproduction of DNA. The purpose of any organism is to have the DNA reproduce further. We are organisms.

Source? A doctor.

I am, as you are, as are homosexuals, and even dandelions and butterflies, a product of my environment. I was raised in an environment where homosexuality is not socially acceptable. Frankly, I also don't care what they do, nor whether or not it is legal for them to be married.
06-11-2008 , 07:30 PM
Although it's completely immaterial to the debate about gay marriage, this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by borovoselo
Any organism is as such due to the reproduction of DNA.

Does not imply this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by borovoselo
The purpose of any organism is to have the DNA reproduce further.

      
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