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11-24-2007 , 02:20 PM
ST,

Nice post.
11-24-2007 , 02:22 PM
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ST,

Nice post.
11-24-2007 , 02:29 PM
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hmmmm. pretty sure min wage isn't $13. I get $10 per hour.
It's been way above $10 for a long time. It's currently $13.46 according to Wikipedia and the article below:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minimum_wage#Australia
http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/10/26/business/pay.php

The Queensland minimum is slightly higher at $528/week:

http://www.wageline.qld.gov.au/awardsonline/qmw.html

This kind of [censored] (along with all the other massive entitlements) will harm the economy over time. We just can't compete in many industries at these rates. My father runs a business (makes a consumer product) and put the price up 50c to cover these increases. That translates to around 65c on Woolworths shelves where the product is sold. He is also now less competitive in export markets. Welcome to inflation, [censored].

This is why I think Australians who voted Labour are a bunch of whiny [censored]. You've got the best IR laws in the world but you won't give the tiniest bit back to allow employers to make executive decisions and cull extra staff and worthless employees. Instead you want a brain dead mediocrity where unproductive and useless employees are protected, and you're too stupid to understand that it's productivity that drives real earnings in the long run. Well, rot in hell, bitches. I'll enjoy collecting the money off your high interest loans and the higher prices you pay on supermarket shelves.
11-24-2007 , 02:43 PM
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Latest update the government has fallen, the opposition takes power (unofficial result endorsed by a few candidates of each party).

I am cracking a bottle of Champagne right now. The liar prime minister hasn't outlived his lies (and might still loose his seat although unlikely, but still a slap in the face swingers from his own constituency). I hope the US gives a similar result in its presidential elections. Good luck!

Wish I had Champagne and folks to share it with. Right now I'm cracking a bottle of Jim Beam by myself. Interesting how so many elections have been anti-U.S. policy lately, except, strangly enough, France.
My two cents. One should check which countries turned left (= almost all those which have strongly supported Bush's policy). In those countries which have refused Bush's policy other issues prevail over war / moral issues. I'm sure some posters will find some exceptions, but those should check a general situation worldwide first. Hopefully most people reject wars / terror / double standards; it's quite easy to predict a continuation of turning left in many countries or US closest allies in case of war against Iran. Cheers mates.
11-24-2007 , 02:46 PM
My answer to that Scary is it's a lot easier to obtain an 80k job to start with given the education system in Australia

Example: a friend of mine was pretty much broke coming out of high school. His parents did not (could not?) financially help him

He got a degree at one of the best Universities in Australia. The government gave him a weekly allowance so a job was not necessary (which I would assume makes it easier to get better grades at Uni). He doesn't have to pay back the government for the Uni fees until he earns above a certain amount per year (don't know specific numbers). All he had to do was do well enough in high school to get in

From what I experienced in America, it's a lot more difficult for a broke guy coming out of high school to get a degree from a really good uni if he has grades just enough to get in (but not get academic scholarships)

But yeah, in Australia it will take like 30% longer or whatev for the 80k guy to catch up to the 40k. He gets there eventually :/
11-24-2007 , 02:57 PM
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Instead you want a brain dead mediocrity where unproductive and useless employees are protected, and you're too stupid to understand that it's productivity that drives real earnings in the long run.
I'm still curious what your thinking. Have we not had free health care, free education, and a high minimum wage for a while now? We've been doing ok the past several decades imo
11-24-2007 , 03:10 PM
^^ just realised you weren't badmouthing free health care and education, ignore those two
11-24-2007 , 03:27 PM
Tiger,

Graded tax systems invalidate much of your point. For example, Australians pay nothing on the first $6K and then a small percentage up to $35K.

And I'm pretty sure the mobility effects of equal, free access to higher education and living assistance would outweigh the small effect that remains.

-- HP - I'll respond later.
11-24-2007 , 03:49 PM
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Graded tax systems magnify much of your point.
Now in 90% Taxland, the 80,000 guy pays full taxes on the top 45,000 of his salary and we'll go with 0% on the first 35,000. The 40,000 guy pays only on the top 5,000.

In 90% Taxland:

After Year 1 39,500 135,500
After Year 2 79,000 171,000
After Year 3 118,500 206,500
After Year 4 158,000 242,000
After Year 5 197,500 277,500
After Year 10 395,000 455,000
After Year 20 790,000 810,000
After Year 23 908,500 916,500
After Year 24 948,000 952,000
After Year 25 987,500 987,500

Ok, I was wrong, it didn't magnify it, but it had no effect.
11-24-2007 , 03:51 PM
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hmmmm. pretty sure min wage isn't $13. I get $10 per hour.
Are you a waiter or some other kind of employee that gets tips? In the US the minimum wage is often lower for service staff who customarily receive gratuities from customers.
I dont get any tips. I make pizza's. Maybe now labour won I'll get a pay rise!
11-24-2007 , 04:15 PM
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hmmmm. pretty sure min wage isn't $13. I get $10 per hour.
Are you a waiter or some other kind of employee that gets tips? In the US the minimum wage is often lower for service staff who customarily receive gratuities from customers.
I dont get any tips. I make pizza's. Maybe now labour won I'll get my kneecaps taken out for working under minimum!
11-24-2007 , 04:35 PM
Yeah, perhaps the pizza making industry will become nationalised and a Vanguard party will put us all in our place now that the Labour party won.
11-24-2007 , 05:05 PM
Another ruling politician who foolishly tied his fortunes to Bush's war in Iraq bites the dust! Australia's Howard is out the door. The PM-elect of Australia is on record that he intends to pull out their troops.

Symbolic rather than materially significant -- but heavily symbolic.

Next up : The Labour Party in Britain. Unbelievable as it might have seemed a few years ago, "Loyal" Tony Blair has managed to resurrect the Conservatives' fortunes from the grave. David Cameron should be the next British PM.
11-24-2007 , 06:04 PM
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What does this mean for my Australian Dollar holdings (straight money market, it's part of the basket I bet against the dollar with)?
Probably not much. There may be an initial knee-jerk reaction to sell AUD tomorrow when the fx market opens given that the perceived less business-friendly candidate won, although in the longer term this change in leadership shouldn't have much impact on the currency. The australian dollar will move up and down based on commodity prices, australian monetary policy, australian economic data, and the general state of risk aversion in the world. Speculators buy up the aussie when risk aversion is low, as it is a high yielder and makes for a great carry trade against lower yielding currencies like the yen and swiss franc. When people panic and world equity markets sell off, the australian dollar suffers, because these same speculators have to cover these carry positions to meet margin calls elsewhere.

Given the clear up trend in gold and other commodities, the general robustness of australia's economy, and the relatively high rates in australia, I expect the currency to continue to strengthen. Any impact from this election on the currency should be short-lived.
11-25-2007 , 01:17 AM
tnx
11-26-2007 , 07:57 PM
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This is why I think Australians who voted Labour are a bunch of whiny [censored]. You've got the best IR laws in the world but you won't give the tiniest bit back to allow employers to make executive decisions and cull extra staff and worthless employees. Instead you want a brain dead mediocrity where unproductive and useless employees are protected, and you're too stupid to understand that it's productivity that drives real earnings in the long run.
I reject the label of whiny [censored]. I voted labor, but not because of industrial relations - I dont think there's a big difference between the two with the exception of unfair dismissal laws (where I lean more towards the liberal position than labor). That may be proved wrong if the unions barge in a la the tv ads - but I doubt that's going to be the reality (and am surprised you've swallowed that line to be frank). I think Rudd has a mountain of power within the ALP and I dont think he's stupid. I think he wants to be in power for more than one term - it's going to be hard enough to manage the looming downturn without going extreme and I dont think he's a slave to ideology.

My reason for voting labor is that I'm not voting for a general manager, I'm voting for a leader. I dont believe there's the chasm of difference in economic credentials between the two parties anymore - although I stand ready to acknowledge my error if that's how it turns out. I am embarassed by Howard's stance on many social issues - the erosion of civil liberties in the name of "counter terrorism", the slavish devotion to the bush position in Iraq, the cynical manipulation of australians' inherent racism and the paralysis on climate change. Economic management is important, but it's not the sole job of a government in my view.

      
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