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Alabama Special Election (Roy Moore diddles, GOP thumbs up, Mr. Jones goes to Washington) Alabama Special Election (Roy Moore diddles, GOP thumbs up, Mr. Jones goes to Washington)

12-09-2017 , 11:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by mosdef
I think my favorite part was "sure lots of women have accused him but only two of them had smoking guns!"

Only two.
This was pretty lol. Obviously we heard the Greatest Hits of Deplorable Roy Moore Defenses like Southern Culture ( My Granpappy In Fact Was A Pedophile Too) and Sorry Statue of Limitations Ran Out, they played some lesser known B-sides like You Got Some Smoking Guns But Baby Smoking Gun Quota Not Met. Don't hear those ones as often but it's great when they surprise the audience like that and bust out the rarely played material.
12-09-2017 , 12:24 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Sklansky
Is it possible that Republicans are holding back some damning evidence until after the election? By doing that they keep Jones from being elected. It also gets them out of the conumdrum that it would be wrong to eject a Senator based purely on evidence that those who put him in office were aware of when they voted.

It’s not possible, how are you this naive? The only takeaway is that Democrats are a greater threat to society than pedophiles for Republicans. This is why we call them deplorables now.
12-09-2017 , 12:48 PM
I have a few facebook friends in alabama, seeing the discussions on this are great, their friend pools are basically all college-educated white people, and basically there are two types of posts from the moore voters

1) yeah he's a pedo but my tax cuts are too important

2) both parties are terrible

I mean, yeah, I'm sympathetic to the "they're all terrible" position but "they're all terrible so I'm voting for the pedo"?
12-09-2017 , 01:01 PM
The Rosseta Stone here to square 'yeah they're both terrible' with '...and we're all voting Moore' is: they're lying. Not about voting for Moore obviously.
12-09-2017 , 01:04 PM
They don't actually believe "both are terrible." That's their absolute last defense when backed into a corner. It is a first cousin of "I'm actually not a Republican, I voted libertarian."
12-09-2017 , 01:18 PM
Right. It's a classic bull**** defense. It's also a close cousin of faux moderation, the old ikestoys / Lestat gambit where you disavow all partisanship, strongly declare your moderate bonafides, then just spew boilerplate right wing talking points for years and years.

APOX ON BOTH HOUSES they declare, now let's get back to common sense political moderation as artfully communicated on moderate non partisan Philosopher King Ben Shapiro's twitter feed, as we said, MODERATE.

Last edited by DVaut1; 12-09-2017 at 01:23 PM.
12-09-2017 , 01:26 PM
"They are all terrible, ok? Now can we get back to a reasoned discussion on the merits of demanding voting rights for black people being horribly detrimental to the long term interests of black people? Also did you know Trayvon Martin was wearing a hoodie?"
12-09-2017 , 01:27 PM
Exactly.
12-09-2017 , 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by pvn
I have a few facebook friends in alabama, seeing the discussions on this are great, their friend pools are basically all college-educated white people, and basically there are two types of posts from the moore voters

1) yeah he's a pedo but my tax cuts are too important

2) both parties are terrible

I mean, yeah, I'm sympathetic to the "they're all terrible" position but "they're all terrible so I'm voting for the pedo"?
To a lot of college educated white people in Alabama:

Strange was better than Moore because Moore is embarrassing;

but

Moore is better than Jones because even crazy pedos are better than Democrats.
12-09-2017 , 02:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by estefaniocurry
The conventional wisdom (so possibly wrong) about the Trump election and the polls is that a lot of voters wouldn't admit publicly their intention to vote for Trump, but then voted for Trump. Is it not possible that the same will happen in Alabama, to Moore's disadvantage? That is, a lot of Republicans won't admit publicly that they intend to vote for Doug Jones because they find Moore disgusting, but will vote against Moore at the ballot? Something like that happened in 1980 when Mack Mattingly was elected to the Senate in GA over Herman Talmadge (in the analogy, the Democrat Talmadge equals Moore, and the Republican Mattingly equals Jones). I know a committed Democrat who admits that once in his life he voted Republican, to get Talmadge out of office.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JordanIB
No, I think you have it backwards. They know Moore is deplorable and don’t necessarily want to catch flack for voting for another sexual predator, so perhaps they don’t say so in a poll, but then snap vote Moore in the voting booth.
No doubt. Moore's blowing out Jones. The positive is that we will have an update on the percentage of Alabaman deplorables. The negatives is that deplorables hate Democrats more than pedophiles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Rococo
What is your evidence that the Washington Post had this story locked and loaded and sat on it? I find that impossible to believe, because the story would have been worth much less if Strange had won the primary, which very easily could have happened.
Look at who you're responding to before wasting your time.

Who was the guy who translated all of poconoder's posts into Russian? That was a funny gimmick.
12-09-2017 , 02:32 PM
I wonder if all the focus on his pedophilia has actually hurt Dems because the 1000 other reasons Roy Moore is bat**** ****ing crazy and completely unqualified and inappropriate to be elected senator have been ignored.

... nah, who am I kidding, Alabama voters wouldn't have given a **** about that
12-09-2017 , 02:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dth123451
They don't actually believe "both are terrible." That's their absolute last defense when backed into a corner. It is a first cousin of "I'm actually not a Republican, I voted libertarian."


Right, these guys talk politics a lot and there have definitely been people making “they’re both terrible” arguments in the past but the people making that argument now are 0% overlapped with the people who were posting that before.
12-09-2017 , 03:09 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bware
I wonder if all the focus on his pedophilia has actually hurt Dems because the 1000 other reasons Roy Moore is bat**** ****ing crazy and completely unqualified and inappropriate to be elected senator have been ignored.

... nah, who am I kidding, Alabama voters wouldn't have given a **** about that
yea i was gonna make a similar post the other day but then i thought about it for like 5 seconds and was like "lol me, the average alabaman republican is also a "christian" cowboy-larping gun nut who thinks america was better when slavery was legal and doesnt want to see non-christians and women voting or holding public office either"
12-09-2017 , 03:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rococo
Oh sure. I'm just trying to emphasize the social dynamics of voting in the South, and the state of the Democratic brand among educated whites in the deep South.

As hard as it is to believe, a lot of people who are voting for Moore are educated. They at least claim not to agree with a lot of what Moore says and does, they know that they not not supposed to be racist or sexist, and they don't believe that they are racist or sexist.
I agree with you on this. The Republicans are still the party of the weller off and the white, and in Alabama those things correspond with having a university education. There's no excuses for these people. They are self-centered me-first religious hypocrites of the purest and most disgusting kind, and they are a majority.
12-09-2017 , 03:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bware
I wonder if all the focus on his pedophilia has actually hurt Dems because the 1000 other reasons Roy Moore is bat**** ****ing crazy and completely unqualified and inappropriate to be elected senator have been ignored.

... nah, who am I kidding, Alabama voters wouldn't have given a **** about that
The thing is even Alabama voters care. Moore, pre pedophilia, was probably going to win by 5-10 while Strange would have won by 30. The problem is Alabama is the worst state in the country on the deplotability index and Moore the pedophile is pretty close to worst person even they would elect.
12-09-2017 , 04:32 PM
Let it not be forgotten that even were he not a pedophile, Moore would be an absolute cretin who was already twice removed from the Alabama supreme court, and it would in any case be a complete outrage to elect him.
12-09-2017 , 05:43 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jiggymike
It’s not possible, how are you this naive? The only takeaway is that Democrats are a greater threat to society than pedophiles for Republicans. This is why we call them deplorables now.
You can't say its not possible unless you maintain the same position when approached from the other direction. In other words lets say the Republicans were in fact given damning evidence a few days ago by someone who was willing to keep it quiet until after the election. Are you so sure they wouldn't play it the way I speculated they might?
12-09-2017 , 06:02 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Huehuecoyotl
To be fair this is a good question in that having her ask it to actual black people means they'd actually have black people answering why they wouldn't vote for Roy Moore and not why they think black people won't vote for Roy Moore, but it's not going to happen.
Yeah, but the way she used the phrase she meant it like, "What's wrong with them that they wouldn't vote for this great man?" Not, "I should go ask them, instead of you asking me."
12-09-2017 , 06:55 PM
Yeah I didn't read that as a legitimate question based in curiosity but a rhetorical question asked to imply that black people are stupid for not voting in a politician who thinks that America was a great place to be when slavery was legal.
12-09-2017 , 07:41 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by David Sklansky
You can't say its not possible unless you maintain the same position when approached from the other direction. In other words lets say the Republicans were in fact given damning evidence a few days ago by someone who was willing to keep it quiet until after the election. Are you so sure they wouldn't play it the way I speculated they might?
What you are suggesting is possible. But like all such theories, it's very unlikely. You would have to believe that all of the following are true:

1. There are, in fact, more teenagers with accusations about Moore OR more evidence associated with one of the known accusations.
2. The woman with the story to tell is a Republican.
3. The woman is willing to go public.
4. The woman or evidence has not yet been discovered by either the Democrats or the press.
5. The woman is so tuned in politically that she contacted the Republican party for guidance on how to proceed.
6. Because the woman is a Republican, the woman is willing to go public at whatever time some unspecified Republican cabal tells her to do so.
7. If presented with the opportunity you describe, the unspecified GOP cabal would act as you imagine -- that is, they would attempt to keep the secret until after the election. In other words,
8. The GOP cabal, the accuser, and whoever else is aware of the plan have been able to keep the plan a secret, at least so far.

Some of these things are entirely possible, but all in them in conjunction seems very unlikely, especially since most of the requirements are independent of one another.
12-10-2017 , 02:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rococo
What you are suggesting is possible. But like all such theories, it's very unlikely. You would have to believe that all of the following are true:

1. There are, in fact, more teenagers with accusations about Moore OR more evidence associated with one of the known accusations.
2. The woman with the story to tell is a Republican.
3. The woman is willing to go public.
4. The woman or evidence has not yet been discovered by either the Democrats or the press.
5. The woman is so tuned in politically that she contacted the Republican party for guidance on how to proceed.
6. Because the woman is a Republican, the woman is willing to go public at whatever time some unspecified Republican cabal tells her to do so.
7. If presented with the opportunity you describe, the unspecified GOP cabal would act as you imagine -- that is, they would attempt to keep the secret until after the election. In other words,
8. The GOP cabal, the accuser, and whoever else is aware of the plan have been able to keep the plan a secret, at least so far.

Some of these things are entirely possible, but all in them in conjunction seems very unlikely, especially since most of the requirements are independent of one another.
That is a nice calculation except that it neglects to take into account that the parlay price must be adjusted in a Baysian way since, before it happened, people thought that it was unlikely that Republicans would be happy to have Moore in the senate if he was not apt to lose his seat. In other words if they would always endorse him if they expected him to be gone (to keep the seat Republican) and endorse him with only a 1/3 probability if they expected him to keep his seat, it means that the above parlay price should be significantly adjusted upward.

Anyway, we will probably see soon enough
12-10-2017 , 12:30 PM
Richard Shelby didn't vote for Roy Moore

Pretty shocked he'd say that publicly.
12-10-2017 , 12:46 PM
No credit given for not voting for the pedophile. It's so sick Republicans have created an environment where people expect credit for things like "repudiating Nazis" and "speaking against a pedophile."
12-10-2017 , 01:12 PM
I'm not applauding the guy. I'm just really surprised he'd come out and say that he voted for someone else on national TV.
12-10-2017 , 04:59 PM
How do you keep voting for the same party for 20+ years when this is what has become of your state ( rhetorical question obv, it's just mindblowing )

ALABAMA HAS THE WORST POVERTY IN THE DEVELOPED WORLD, U.N. OFFICIAL SAYS

http://www.newsweek.com/alabama-un-p...-racism-743601

      
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