By lying and putting a misleading graphic in front of you


How do u not realize this?

How have they managed to convince these people over the past 30 years that repealing estate taxes and cutting capital gains taxes helps Joe Six Pack? Some people can be fooled all of the time. idk if this will pass, but "it can't pass because it hurts their voters" is objectively wrong.

They did it with a plausible-sounding argument, "these tax cuts will help job creators create jobs". What's the plausible sounding argument for a big tax increase on retirement account holders?

They will just ****ing lie, and the Trumpkins will believe them. Trump told them he'd build a 20 foot, invisible wall across the entire Mexican border, believe me, the spin doctors will find a way to bull**** Republican voters.

Like, awval here in this very forum is still on the fence about whether Trump's tax plan will help him!

They can always bundle it with some other token tax giveaway to confuse the issue and call it a wash. PEOPLE WANT CHOICES! Now let's look at a black woman with a cowboy hat. Lol silly, black women can't be cowboys. What a loon.

You're not being very creative and you're ignoring recent history.

They will argue job creation for cap gains / pass through and fiscal restraint for the middle class gape job. Done.

$80 yearly deduction for handgun owners. $100 for bump stock owners. The deductions will be given out as gift certificates for Trump Steaks and Trump Hotels.

At least we're getting something! What did those Democrats ever give us?

it truly is amazing. kidd, one of the smarter posters, tho likely not as smart as he thinks he is, is watching the repubs propose a tax plan that will undoubtedly hurt middle class voters. what is the reason for that, ie, why are the repubs trying to pass such a plan? so that the rich can get more money in their pockets.

his response is, well, its not that much money. I mean, ya, they are sure to lose to money, but its not a lot of money. he then argues that since it is not a ton of money, that makes it a "reasonable" proposal or plan.

now heres the real disconnect. kidd, after watching the repubs screw over the middle class and force them to lose money, somehow has it in his head that there is absolutely no way at all that they would overreach just a little more later on. its totally unfathomable to him that they would screw over the middle class later on. he cant even surmise a situation where they attempt it.

but this thing that they are doing right now, is totally reasonable and not a big deal.

I'll certainly concede that you guys are being extremely creative. Kudos?

We're not throwing anything out that hasn't already happened multiple times.

Obama's FICA tax cut? No - we have to end that because it endangers the Social Security program. Base ate it up - literally said raise my taxes please. o_O

"They tried to rip healthcare from 20 million people and failed. By one vote. Therefore they would never come for the retirement accounts!"

Seriously bro?

Changing the 401k cap to 2800 while keeping the Roth 401k cap at 18500 is objectively not a big change. Its a small tax increase on middle and upper middle folks. Note that I don't think that the Republicans will actually go through with this as I think it will make a lot of people quite mad.

So I think that's a reasonable law change, I don't really have a strong feeling one way or another when retirement contributions should be taxed.

Now, remember I don't think that Republicans will be able to get the 401k changes, that too many people like their 401k and don't want it to be changed. So I don't think this small change is politically feasible. So of course I don't think that the enormous change of retroactively abolishing Roths after forcing people to switch to mostly Roths is going to happen. That's not "overreaching a little more". That's a huge huge change, an enormous bait and switch and people would be furious. And it's not that I think Republicans care about the middle class and upper middle class. But they, like all politicians, don't want to make tens of millions of people completely furious

You're evidence of how they will get away with it! You have, in like SIX HOURS, gone from "they would never do that" to "not a big change, doesn't matter."

They failed to do something that a big vocal fraction of their base wanted done. And something they've collectively campaigned on for years. But who wants this hallucinated and massive overhaul of retirement accounts? No one.

So something they campaigned on for years and many voters wanted was close. This massive overhaul of retirement accounts has no support and many obvious opponents within the Republican base. It will never get passed.

What? No. This is what I said the whole time

1) The proposed 401k change isn't a big change and wouldn't hurt anyone too badly
2) The hallucinated liberal fever dream retroactive Roth repeal proposal after the 401k change would be a huge deal, would hurt many many people and is just completely politically not feasible and will not happen.

I also don't think the Republicans will go ahead with the 401k change because that moderate change would piss too many people off (which is why they're floating this trial balloon), but that's neither here nor there.

its not getting passed today.

but we are talking about years later when the republican stranglehold has become self evident and the donor class wants a new handout.

I am kinda with you on the whole, "who cares, it doesnt matter, no big deal" type mentality. bc there really is nothing that we can do about it and you know what they say about when the inevitable is gonna happen and how to react.

I also pretty strongly disagree with you about the extent of the Republican stranglehold on government. The Republicans are going balls to the wall on voter suppression because of the demographic tidal wave they face. But ultimately Republicans are going to have to get more moderate as their old racist pos voters die off.

Hi I'm worried about republicans arbitrarily changing the rules and essentially confiscating my retirement accounts to give to billionaires. Should i start hording physical gold and silver? I'll hang up and listen

So that's how they're selling this? Craven evil scum.

As a poor boy from a poor family, I appreciate the education on taxes and retirement savings I'm getting itt, so thanks all. But I have to say it is pretty tilting to read...

... the top 3 and even the top 1 percent refered to as the "middle" class. It is good that this so-called "middle" class will pay more taxes. The bad part is where their money goes, i.e. to the super rich.

You're not wrong here, but you have to trust me that the definition of "middle class" is not a can of worms you want to open.

not its not. thats the point. the richie rich ie the top .1-1% have enough that they can take care of the lower classes.

the middle class is shrinking greatly. it seems that those salaries are nice but they really arent, esp when you consider the cost of raising a kid and the cost of living as compared to the 60s and 70s.

the point is that the so-called middle class is a lot worse off than it was in the last generations despite overall profits drastically increasing.

I said upper middle class. A 500k lawyer is a 1 percenter but lives an entirely different life than the people who really pull the strings.

I mean, yes, people making 300k-1M/yr are "rich", but politically they are (or should be) aligned with labor. Tons of those folks are earning wages doing real work rather than being part of the owning class. Their political influence far lags the 0.1 percent.