I often try to fight frequent blind-stealers by 3bet-bluffing them from the blinds.

However, this happens to me a lot in 1/2nl:

Villain opens OTB or CO to $7, folds to me in the BB, I 3bet to $24 with 67, villain flats.

Flop comes whatever, pot is $50

I cbet $30 into $50, villain raises (sometimes minraises, sometimes 3x, sometimes shoves).

And I'm boned.


It seems to me that rarely do I take the pot down with a cbet when they flat IP. If I play back at their raise over my cbet, I run into a huge hand that was slowplayed.

I'm beginning to think that unless the board is super good to cbet (like K72r), I'm just going to c/f most flops because guys never fold these days. It just seems more profitable to check/fold 3bet pots oop more often nowadays when you don't hit the board.

Have you guys been having mucho success with cbetting into 3bet pots oop when your 3bet-bluff gets flatted?

It's very likely that you 3 bet too much and so good players play back at you. 76o is a garbage hand to be honest and to 3 bet OOP with this hand you need to have strong reads or tight image and Villain that is able of folding. Once you balance your 3 betting range it will be much easier to take down pots postflop

Yep yep, people just don't fold because they all know that everyone 3bets light and they know that people don't have an overpair every time. Just cut down on your cbet frequency and double barrel good boards more often.

well maybe you shouldnt fight for every pot. dont get why people get so antsy about ppl stealing blinds.

Yeah this too but I figured people would start up the argument that "lol its a good hand to 3bet stop being a nit" if I said that.

lol...my fold sb/bb to steal is something like almost 90%. playing oop vs. aggro players in rr-ed pots (especially when you arent really great at playing rr-ed pots much less OOP) its a recipe for disaster.

You should 3bet with hands with some value. 76s is a lot better than 76o just because you can shove on the flop with a flush draw. Also keep in mind that balance is important in 3bet pots.

If people seem to always call your 3-bets and then don't fold on the flop, then maybe in addition to 3-betting less, you should change the hands you 3-bet with. Try 3-betting hands that you will make pairs you can call their bluffshoves with, like KJ or AT.

I wonder why

Is the reason that I'm not having much success in my 3bet cbets due to my limit being 1/2nl?

Are msnl players actually capable of folding to 3bet cbets?

Orange, I'm not fighting for every pot, just every once in a while I need to 3bet-bluff to balance with my 3bets for value.

I play a 24/20/4 game and my 3bet% is between 8-10%. I think what a lot of people are doing is simply folding their speculative hands vs. my 3bets and calling with premium hands with the intention of raising over my cbets. Is this likely? If so, it then becomes more profitable to 3bet bluff and give up unless board is awesome.

there was a cool thread in msnl a while back on this subject, that is what hands to 3-bet (chastrocize says 67s baluga says KQ). cant remember where it is though and cant be bothered to find it.

There's no way in hell am I 3betting hands like KJ AT. They're dominated way way way too often.

less likely that ppl are floating you, 4b is an easier option for them

if you're getting raised on the flop it's likely they're hitting

if you're getting called on flop something like J53 they prolly have 66-TT

cbetting in rr pot oop too much is suicide unless you're gonna shove turns

k nevermind im nice and found the post

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/sh...036&highlight=

also LOL chaser at those hands being dominated. tags 4-bet AK so frequently these days that its hilarious.

Cheers orange. I'm gonna look for it. If someone can find it, I think it'll be a sweet thread for those of us struggling to master 3betting.

Chaser, try 3betting wayyyy more in position than out of position. Everyone feels the need to outplay each other so they call 3bets pretty light in position. BTN v CO, BB v SB, etc... Blinds vs BTN is just going to end in a lot of bloated pots OOP because everyone is ******ed and justifies that they're raising a wide range on the button and so you'll be 3betting wide to counter that and so they're gonna call and outplay (by this I mean outflop obv) you.

if you dont 3b these hands that means you aren't 3b'ign that much which really leads me to believe people aren't floating/bluffing you

I think it's all in your head

This is a hell of an ancient thread, games have evolved a lot since then. Both are right, it just depends on a lot of things.

also, if you think they are floating you/bluffing you the last thing you want to do is rr 67o but not KJ/AT. KJ/AT at least hit the toppest pair whereas you're basically ALWAYS bluffing with 67o

Yes AK for sure, but what about KQ AQ sometimes even AJ that calls us when we have KJ AT?

i think your 3bet sizing is a bit off, I normally 3bet to 4-4.5x the pfr when out of position

This is a lot of nonsense. This is depends on ranges, images, position ,postflop tendencies in both raised and reraised pots, people behind, a ****load of things.
Domination is also a little overrated. When you both hold a K, chances to flop one is fairly low.

8-10 3 bet % is way too high IMO. Mine used to be around 5-7% on FTP and now it's around 4% after I changed site

lol its 4 months old...games havent changed that much.

I have a confession to make....

I haven't 3bet light oop in about 2-3 weeks.