reg in the bb has a 3b BBvsBTN of 11% out of 75 times.
Fold to 4b 3 out of 5 times BBvsBTN.

Thoughts about this line please

CO: $73.49 - VPIP: 21, PFR: 16, 3B: 6, AF: 2,8, Hands: 664
Hero (BTN): $50.75 -
SB: $56.44 - VPIP: 25, PFR: 21, 3B: 11, AF: 2,8, Hands: 442
BB: $99.00 - VPIP: 21, PFR: 17, 3B: 7, AF: 3,7, Hands: 1447

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is BTN with K 9
1 fold, Hero raises to $1.50, 1 fold, BB raises to $5, Hero raises to $10, BB calls $5

Flop: ($20.25) T A 6 (2 players)
BB checks, Hero bets $7.00, BB raises to $89, Hero calls $33.75 all in

Turn: ($101.75) J (2 players - 1 is all in)

River: ($101.75) J (2 players - 1 is all in)

I don't 4bet/bluff much but I usually pick Axs hands like A5s/A9o, for Kx, may be KTo? K9s blocks some K combos and 99 but that's about it. I think it's OK.

As played, snap call on flop, once you 4bet this hand, you just have to go with it and then reload and think later.

Ax obv has the most blockervalue, after that Kx.
Same reason why you 4b A3, because of the A, I 4b Kx because of the K.
Obv KQ KJ will be in there a bunch of the time, as well as AJ.

I did snapcall obv :P pot odds mannnnnn

Lol don't min-bet on a 4bet bluff, you're giving villain great pot odds for a call when you do that. I would have 4Bet to 15 in this spot and force villain to a much tougher calling decision

Great odds with what range of hands?
When I 4b to 15 as a bluff, Im obligated to 4b to 15 with my valuerange also.
Since villian 3bets a lot, this is actually my first hand that I light 4b and got it in with.

I disagree, I think 20BB to 25BB is quite acceptable, I rarely get flatted because I'm on top. In wrestling this is an awesome advantage to have.

Also, in man on man lovemaking

Yes you absolutely should be 4betting to 15 here with your value hands. When you 4Bet it should be big enough that when your opponent 5bets you it will be all-in ($16 4bet) or close enough to it. You can do a little bit less such as $14 4bet, but definitely not to $10.

Great odds with a wide range of hands. You are offering him roughly 3:1 to see a flop aka 25% and he's gonna hit that flop 33% of the time in one way or another so...

I don't think you know what you are talking about if you are advising that a 20BB 4bet is fine. Both of you should read up on 3bet/4bet strategy from expert voices if you "disagree" with me

WTF are you smoking? How in the hell do you get people to feel the illusion of fold equity when you 4bet to 30 faaking BB?

Ship me some of that stuff, are you Jesse Pinkman?

Probably can get away with just flatting preflop. If your not i guess 4b/folding is fine. Would prefer hands like KJo or A9 or something but hardly a big difference. Just make sure you make sure you dont overdo it.

As for flop size i love it, think its great to turn range into a 3 street game here rather then 2. Get alot of flop peals that folds turn and maybe a crazy CR/f sometimes.

As played shrug call it off against a terribly played AQ or a random FD.

Well played hand.

Edit: 4bet sizing pre is also lovely.

The fact that all 3 of you are fine with a 20BB 4bet makes me feel like nobody here knows what they are talking about.

Like I said above, don't listen to me, go read basic strategy on 3Bet/4Bet. They can also explain it in much more depth. With regards to this, you guys are clearly clueless. But you don't have to take my word for it as Im encouraging to do some research on your own

Thing about 4betting small IP is that the range that would fold to 30bbs pre are usually on the low end of a pulverized range. This includes **** hands that have reversed implied against our range. We can easily outplay and out range those hands post and want them calling even if their "getting the right odds".

Personally i instantly consider anyone making it 30bbs here pre a fish/terrible reg. Thats just me though.

I play 100NL Zoom 6Max fairly often and I have never seen a decent reg or a decent reg who is SuperNova 4bet pre on BTN vs SB/BB to more than 24BB. It's usually around 20BB to 22.50BB just so you know. DaWarsaw, Flix, paddington, SNG Grind(when I play some 200NL), etc etc

Lol fine y'all keep doing the same old without bothering to look something up when it is questioned. Lots of articles out there covering this, but I wish more players stubbornly stuck to their own premonitions as to why something is correct. Keeps these games juicy lol what do I know, anyway?


And lol @ citing the actions of a few regs at 100NL zoom as setting the stage for what you are supposed to do. Monkey see monkey do

Thank you

Longtime winning regs are hardly monkeys.
Anyways, sizing of the bets will be affected by the dynamics of the game and the dynamics of you and the other reg, imo.

If you are value 4betting the vast majority of your range, 4b larger and throw a couple of blockers in.
For me, I like to widen my range, hence the smaller 4bets.

Think about this. We 4bet to 15 and villain folds his 78cc. We 4bet to 10 and he calls. We get this flop and villain decides to c/jam with his gutter and BDFD. We (with our stronger range) will be able to call a lot here and will be making a lot of money from villain.

Scenario 2: villain calls with A9 and gets it in here. (either by shoving flop or calling/calling) We have AK/AQ a lot and win a lot of money.

Scenario 3: Villain 5bet ships pre-flop as a bluff more often since our 4-bet range is wider when we go with a smaller size => we get payed more often when we have TT+ AQ/AK.

Just cause we get odds to call doesn't mean we can call when we're facing a range that we're behind against because poker doesn't end pre-flop unless we're all in. We have to play post-flop and calling with a weaker range is going to lose us more money post flop.

If we just have a super tight 4-bet range with no bluffs then obviously 4-betting small is stupid because villain can happily call with hands that could stack us post-flop as a massive favourite (eg. set-mining) since we won't be folding post-flop but when we can have bluffs set-mining no longer becomes viable since we're not automatically stacking off post-flop.

If anything it's lol @ citing what is most probably out of date articles on 3/4-bet strategy. Think about tourney's as well. Everyone min-r tourneys these days even though they are giving BB odds to call. But that doesn't mean BB should (or does) call with his entire range since his weak range is going to cost him chips post flop.

nh, op.

4bet sizing is fine.
flop c-bet size is fine.
once he ships it, you are obviously committed to call.

That said, i'd rather flat K9s pre, but 4betting is fine too, if you don't feel comfortable playing this hand.
But once you get to the flop, the hand plays itself really.

It's interesting to me that it's taken NL players so many years to figure out that no-limit is not limit poker. I curse the person who pointed out the obvious.

Thank god for players like you. You sure help to keep the games juicy.

LOL, just kidding, obviosuly you are correct. There's no point in trying to educate 1/2 these clowns on 2+2 who think 20-24bb 4 bets are the correct play. 99% are BE regs anyways.

I read thru some of you past posts and judging from the fact that you play 14/12 at 6 max and are doing well means you are doing something right compared to 1/2 these clowns who half to play 21/17 cause thats what all the cool kids are doing.

Plus I couldn't agree with you more in one of your threads where you don't understand how these pro's have 20+ buyin swings because most pros are playing with 40 buyins. I don't get it either.

If you want to talk strategy, hit me up on Skype. I'm always looking to talk with guys who think things thru and don't follow the cookie cutter BE strategy that 99% of 2+2 does these days.
Thefunbegins on Skype

Meaning?

This thread is derailed.
Thanks

You don't always call pre-flop just because you had odds, where in limit you would. Being able to bet any amount post flop, changes how you should consider calling/folding against someone's range and stack size.

In other words you agree with 4bet size of 20bb?