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NL100: QQ oop 3-way vs. 2 fish NL100: QQ oop 3-way vs. 2 fish

09-30-2009 , 03:10 PM
NL100 on PS, table was a mixture of three nits and two loose fish (both were in this hand). UTG (OR in this hand) was 38/25 preflop, folds to 3bet 50%, very passive and stationary postflop (though over a very small sample size). The cold-caller was 38/35 preflop, folds 50% to 3bet as well, very aggro postflop (AF 6.0) over 75 hands. No special notes on either of them.

Fwiw my image was "normal" LAG-TAG (28/22, 6% 3-bet, AF 3.0) but I doubt either of Villains was interested in / aware of my play.

I discussed this hand controversely in another forum so I´m looking forward to hear some more opinions ...

Poker Stars $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official DeucesCracked.com Hand History Converter

UTG: $195.50
MP: $119.60
CO: $100.00
BTN: $295.85
Hero (SB): $144.15
BB: $100.00

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is SB with Q Q
UTG raises to $3, MP calls $3, 2 folds, Hero raises to $11, 1 fold, UTG calls $8, MP calls $8

Please don´t criticize my 3-bet-size, it was actually a misclick ...

Flop: ($34.00) 8 9 K (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP bets $12, Hero calls $12, UTG calls $12

Turn: ($70.00) 4 (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP checks

River: ($70.00) 5 (3 players)
Hero checks, UTG checks, MP bets $96.60 all in, Hero ???

- Tack -
09-30-2009 , 03:23 PM
3bet size is fine to me
I feel like checking here leads these other players to believe you have an underpair/AQ
I think I would cbet about 21 dollars and if I take heat from CC I'm probably stacking off
09-30-2009 , 04:08 PM
i think pf is pretty whatever, flop i guess you can bet fold? c/f is ok to a normal bet i think as well...river i think is a dump
09-30-2009 , 04:18 PM
so 2 random fish called a flop cbet in 3bet pot K high flop, flush hit on the turn and they both check and then one of them overbet shoves the river. sure JT missed but? if u guys make your money this way i guess im just terrible then

think flop b/f is good aswell you'll get called by worse pretty often. I'd go for 14+ pf
09-30-2009 , 06:51 PM
Against a station and an aggrotard flop is a c/f for me.
09-30-2009 , 07:33 PM
if its a fish... shouldnt u just be waiting for good hands and betting them for value?
10-01-2009 , 03:22 AM
Nobody calling the river? Please tell me what range you give him ... remember, he is an "aggro" fish?
11-24-2009 , 11:33 AM
river is a fold
11-24-2009 , 11:39 AM
Flushes/Kx/67/air I guess

Seems like an easy fold multiway

Not unusual for fish to be aggro with marginal stuff, and then really passive with strong hands.
11-24-2009 , 11:45 AM
I think I would check the flop if it was dry, but you absolutely must charge the draws here so a cBet is a must for me.

River is a fold imo. I see this a lot from fish who think it is clever to miss value by not betting their flushes on the turn, hoping to get a bit more on the river (and I'm guessing it worked here?!)

ul
11-24-2009 , 11:51 AM
At least one of them has a flush here the vast majority of the time imo. Especially aggro fish's line is screaming flush to me. First he makes the small flop bet to build a pot/win it right away with his draw, then he hits on the turn and slowplays it like a pro. So he gets to the river, realizes "omg i haz the nuts and no money in the pot" and shoves his stack in.
Also completely agree with chaos. If this guy wanted to bluff why not do it on the turn? If he's super aggro why didn't he b/f on the turn with air or marginal sd value? It's not impossible for him to play air like this, but it's pretty likely he made a flush there imo.

On the flop I'd prefer b/f over c/c. They'll call you pretty wide, so you can bet for value but it also gives you an idea of where you're at. Though it would be a really ugly spot if aggro donk raises, but probably a fold.
11-24-2009 , 11:54 AM
I fold and don't think it's all that close...Agree also b/f flop is probably slightly better than c/c
11-24-2009 , 12:07 PM
flop lead is best to avoid playing any kind of guessing game on later streets, as played fold river ..
11-24-2009 , 12:39 PM
Bet the flop. You wont be able to profitably bluffcatch and see cheap showdowns, especially against these players on such a draw heavy flop. If you are going to check, its to c/f.

C/C this flop is going to make your life hell on future streets. And your reverse implied odds when c/c this flop pretty much don't exist. There's really no turn or river cards that improve your hand and you will set yourself up to get valuetowned very light. Had MP picked a non ******ed bet sizing for the river, I'm sure you call, given your line, and that wouldn't have ended well.

      
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