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50NL Rush: ATo in 4bet pot 50NL Rush: ATo in 4bet pot

08-13-2010 , 08:35 AM
Villain in this coup is 22/13/1.5 11.5%3bet (29% 3bet in sb, or 2/7) wtsd 21. Sample size about 90 hands. This is Rush and tbh I didnt remember playing any significant hands with him. Unlikely that I 4bet him previously as I would have remembered, and I dont 4bet bluff that much anyway.


Full Tilt Poker $0.25/$0.50 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

Hero (BTN): $89.80
SB: $50.00
BB: $74.25
UTG: $81.15
MP: $20.00
CO: $50.00

Pre Flop: ($0.75) Hero is BTN with A T
3 folds, Hero raises to $1.50, SB raises to $5, 1 fold, Hero raises to $12.50, SB calls $7.50

Flop: ($25.50) 9 5 6 (2 players)
SB checks, Hero checks

Turn: ($25.50) K (2 players)
SB checks, Hero bets $11, SB calls $11

River: ($47.50) T (2 players)
SB bets $26.50 all in, Hero ?

1) 4bet, call, or fold pre?
2) Is turn bet ok? (Size is just to set up a 1/2 decent sized shove on the river). Should I try rep the K or just give up?
3) WTF does villain have on the river?

Arrgh, wrong place soz. Can a mod move this to the micro thread? Apologies.

No mods about so I reposted myself. ?ust delete if u have time/bothered :-)

Last edited by DangerDoom82; 08-13-2010 at 08:49 AM.
08-13-2010 , 09:22 AM
I have no idea what he has, but I tend to usually lose when I call in these spots.
08-13-2010 , 09:23 AM
To clarify, this is a line that donks and mediocre regs take with value hands a lot in fear of the river being checked back.
08-13-2010 , 09:31 AM
Just fold pre. Dude is 22/13 I doubt he's even capable of getting out of line 3betting. Over 90 hands you're not going to be able to put much confidence in his 3betting % overall much less his positional 3betting.
08-13-2010 , 09:31 AM
Shove or fold pre? So small sample, so he may call that 4b very wide if he is bad and you have too shallow stacks to play optimally post flop against an unknown IMO. If you wanna semi-bluff pre, a hand like AT is a good one, since you have two overs vs many pairs, the ace cuts his likelihood of having AK/AA etc, and the ten is usually not dominated and you almost always have one over.

edit; then again I dont know anything how 50 NL rush on FTP plays,.

Last edited by Insistent_; 08-13-2010 at 09:37 AM.
08-13-2010 , 11:08 AM
^^ so we should just push preflop 100BB deep after him having put 10BB in ? solid plan
08-13-2010 , 11:24 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by beHypE
^^ so we should just push preflop 100BB deep after him having put 10BB in ? solid plan
This can be a viable strategy with small to medium PPs vs villains that 3bet very wide, but not with AT.
08-13-2010 , 01:31 PM
You have exploited yourself here.
08-13-2010 , 01:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by riske
I have no idea what he has, but I tend to usually lose when I call in these spots.
KQ? AK? slowplayed KK+?

hell, I've seen some tards flat 99 (when shove pre is a billion times better)
btw I agree 90 hands is not a good sample to start 4bing people randomly
I 4b after someone 3bs my steal particularly a few times and 3bs mostly other regs
I mean, if he 3b someone's UTG raise as MP I would assume he just had a hand
then another time he could have 3b a fish with a hand like AJo to isolate/get value from worse etc.
08-13-2010 , 01:41 PM
spewww everywhere.
08-13-2010 , 01:55 PM
Sorry for polluting the small stakes thread with my micro crap!

Quote:
Originally Posted by riske
To clarify, this is a line that donks and mediocre regs take with value hands a lot in fear of the river being checked back.
Trew. But what strong hands checks two streets OOP on this wet board? And then shove the riv?

Quote:
Originally Posted by blackize
Just fold pre. Dude is 22/13 I doubt he's even capable of getting out of line 3betting. Over 90 hands you're not going to be able to put much confidence in his 3betting % overall much less his positional 3betting.
Disagree slightly. When a villain 3bets 3 times in 8 in exactly the same position in 90 hands I think it's more likely he's 3betting wider than just getting premiums. I understand that his sb 3bet over 1000 hands will not be 23%. I'm also more inclined to play back in this spot in a rush game than in a standard game as villains are less worried about image, therefore are less likely to make sure they have it when they 3bet later. If they are ever worried about it for that matter.

In the end I spazz called coz I was struggling to put villain on a strong hand when he checked twice on this wet board. He showed 45.

Spoiler:
of diamonds



Quote:
Originally Posted by shadylane
spewww everywhere.
Agreed. but only post :-(
08-13-2010 , 02:13 PM
Quote:
Disagree slightly. When a villain 3bets 3 times in 8 in exactly the same position in 90 hands I think it's more likely he's 3betting wider than just getting premiums. I understand that his sb 3bet over 1000 hands will not be 23%. I'm also more inclined to play back in this spot in a rush game than in a standard game as villains are less worried about image, therefore are less likely to make sure they have it when they 3bet later. If they are ever worried about it for that matter.
Yes he's probably lighter from the SB vs BTN. But who knows if that means 6% or 16%? The default should absolutely be to fold hands like this. If you really think he's getting out of line then make a small 4bet and fold to a shove. But this should be a rare occurrence.
08-13-2010 , 02:43 PM
you have a bluffcatcher where villain is never bluffing?
08-13-2010 , 02:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by iopq
KQ? AK? slowplayed KK+?
yeah, i just meant it can be pretty much a bajillion different stuff, almost all for value.

      
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