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200nl 33 set vs flop rr 200nl 33 set vs flop rr

04-06-2015 , 03:48 AM
Hey. I'm wondering how to play vs this flop rr? Unknown reg.
I think it's a typical nuts vs nuts spot, so I don't like to re-raise flop. Thoughts?

888 Poker - $2 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 5 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4

BTN: $123.66 (VPIP: 75.00, PFR: 25.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 8)
SB: $200.00 (VPIP: 18.18, PFR: 13.64, 3Bet Preflop: 9.09, Hands: 23)
Hero (BB): $204.40
UTG: $200.43 (VPIP: 62.50, PFR: 50.00, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 8)
CO: $220.62 (VPIP: 24.64, PFR: 17.39, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 70)

SB posts SB $1.00, Hero posts BB $2.00

Pre Flop: (pot: $3.00) Hero has 3 3

fold, CO raises to $5.25, fold, fold, Hero calls $3.25

Flop: ($11.50, 2 players) 6 3 7
Hero checks, CO bets $7.00, Hero raises to $24.37, CO raises to $54.00, Hero calls $29.63

Turn: ($119.50, 2 players) 5
Hero checks, CO bets $161.37, fold

Spoiler:
CO wins $115.50
04-06-2015 , 04:10 AM
I don't play much 200NL, but I'll assume you guys are much tougher than 50NL & 100NL.

In my games against an unknown I'm shipping money in with a set as fast as I can on these wet flops. I just figure with a set even if I'm behind I have re-draws and if villain has 66, 77 well too bad. If villain has 45 or some other great flush/straight draw too bad too.

I'm shipping flop.
04-06-2015 , 05:31 AM
I'd fold to re-raise... in theory. Spot where it's nuts vs nuts like you said and yours is worst nuts.

We have 20% equity vs 66-77, 45s, 8d9d
04-06-2015 , 06:02 AM
Tough spot, It takes some discipline to fold here.. and probably thats the best play vs this unknown with tightish stats
04-06-2015 , 09:15 AM
No, fold is definitely not the best. Just ship it after he 3bets.
04-06-2015 , 09:19 AM
I'm in the just ship it camp. Yeah he could have the nuts but there are so many other hands that will pay us off as well. Deeper it becomes more difficult.
04-06-2015 , 10:40 AM
pre is not great... ship it in post, just think about our range in this spot
04-06-2015 , 10:53 AM
whats wrong with pre
04-06-2015 , 11:04 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshimiii
I'd fold to re-raise... in theory. Spot where it's nuts vs nuts like you said and yours is worst nuts.

We have 20% equity vs 66-77, 45s, 8d9d
yeah, it's not like he can be bluffing here...
04-06-2015 , 01:29 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshimiii
I'd fold to re-raise... in theory.
Fold in theory, what...you sure?

I would jam flop fwiw

Pre is fine

Last edited by TWhelan; 04-06-2015 at 01:36 PM.
04-06-2015 , 09:25 PM
I think it might come down to the type of villian. Is he overly aggressive with overpair/flush-draw-with-two-overs type of hands? If not, I might just fold the flop, if there is dynamic or he is LAG type of a villian I would just ship it on the flop. Unknown villian I'd probably play the same way as OP.
04-06-2015 , 09:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IClickButtons
pre is not great.
lol uhm?
04-06-2015 , 10:41 PM
I mean I don't understand your flop raise if you are unsure what to do facing a 3b.
04-07-2015 , 01:43 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TWhelan
Fold in theory, what...you sure?

I would jam flop fwiw

Pre is fine
Edit: Ye you probably can't fold now you re-raise, results orientated I think I am.

Last edited by Yoshimiii; 04-07-2015 at 01:57 AM.
04-07-2015 , 10:17 AM
Your play is nice.
Shove is -ev play. Just call.
04-07-2015 , 11:33 AM
The guy is 24/17, albeit over 70 hands. I'd be surprised if he had 45s. You're looking at 66, 77, or a higher pair. You're dead against 66 or 77. You've got 87% against a higher pair. Presumably your $30 call on the flop into the $90 pot is to see if he has the higher pair and will check next round. That's a high price to pay.

All else being equal (i.e. he isn't just reraising you on the flop because you have a pattern of folding to a reraise) I think the best play is fold on the reraise. Next best move is to shove all in. Calling the reraise and hoping he will check on the turn or you will improve doesn't seem profitable.
04-09-2015 , 08:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by hidry99
Your play is nice.
Shove is -ev play. Just call.
How can a shove be -ev? There are plenty of scare cards that can come on the turn which allow V to move us of the hand (like the one that did come) and there are also cards which scare V of his hand (). GII here should be fine..

How do we know he isn't doing this with his overpairs and premiums?
04-09-2015 , 08:57 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panlux
-
How do we know he isn't doing this with his overpairs and premiums?
Because that would be ******ed
04-09-2015 , 09:37 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshimiii
Because that would be ******ed
Please give me one reason as to why this isn't AA/KK?

Also, thanks for your productive answer it really explains a lot.....
04-09-2015 , 09:39 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panlux
Please give me one reason as to why this isn't AA/KK?

Also, thanks for your productive answer it really explains a lot.....
Because re-raising overpairs are completely overplaying them. Only really terrible villain's would do that.

He's decent stats and it's 200nl so we can't presume he's that ******ed.
04-09-2015 , 09:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yoshimiii
He's decent stats and it's 200nl so we can't presume he's that ******ed.
this is just incomplete reasoning

plenty of people have a non-terrible preflop strategy and a mediocre to terrible postflop strategy. we don't need many combos of hands not in the range listed earlier in this thread to make folding the flop a large error.

the average player at these limits will not necessarily choose a rational 3betting strategy here, and it is very easy to 3bet the flop far too often if we have a narrow value range and a slightly too-wide initial cbet range.
04-10-2015 , 02:12 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by terp
this is just incomplete reasoning

plenty of people have a non-terrible preflop strategy and a mediocre to terrible postflop strategy. we don't need many combos of hands not in the range listed earlier in this thread to make folding the flop a large error.

the average player at these limits will not necessarily choose a rational 3betting strategy here, and it is very easy to 3bet the flop far too often if we have a narrow value range and a slightly too-wide initial cbet range.
Guess I'm wrong then.
04-10-2015 , 06:37 AM
If I was worried about the 3b, I Prob wouldn't raise at all.

Guess it also depends on your own image.
Tbh I would ship flop just because I think it's too hard to play turns such as these. If he's bluffing we win a decent pot. It's also the the only way we can have a bluff i guess.

If we're not shoving 33 for value what are we shoving?
04-10-2015 , 07:40 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JoseMourinho
whats wrong with pre
Generally I would 3bet or fold because it is not played well in a single raise pot against a decent player oop, against 2.5bb open I think it is fine to call though.
04-10-2015 , 10:06 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by IClickButtons
Generally I would 3bet or fold because it is not played well in a single raise pot against a decent player oop, against 2.5bb open I think it is fine to call though.
But 33 plays well in a bloated pot oop, not to mention it has no blockers to villains 4-bet range? Honestly, pre is the most standard call of all time unless I'm way out of touch.

      
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