100NL: KQ - River Call? - Small Stakes Pot Limit and No Limit

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100NL: KQ - River Call?

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11-17-2008 , 01:26 AM

TPTK77

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

Villain is a Tagfish playing 31/10 over ~50 hands. He has been pretty loose preflop, but I haven't see him do anything out of line.

Are we good enough of the time bc flush draws missed?

Full Tilt Poker $0.50/$1 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $114.65
BB: $299.25
UTG: $164.70
Hero (MP): $103.15
CO: $239.75
BTN: $94.90

Pre Flop: ($1.50) Hero is MP with Q

1 fold, Hero raises to $4, 1 fold, BTN calls $4, 2 folds

Flop: ($9.50) 6

(2 players)
Hero bets $7, BTN raises to $21, Hero calls $14

Turn: ($51.50) 7

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $27, Hero calls $27

River: ($105.50) 3

(2 players)
Hero checks, BTN bets $42.90 all in, Hero ??????

11-17-2008 , 01:40 AM

jdaman

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 136

Fold turn if you're not calling that river

11-17-2008 , 02:00 AM

TPTK77

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdaman

Fold turn if you're not calling that river

ugh i don't think we can EVER fold turn given that it was a blank. i think its really bad if you do.

also, just bc we called turn doesn't mean we HAVE to call this river.

11-17-2008 , 02:02 AM

jdaman

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 136

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPTK77

ugh i don't think we can EVER fold turn given that it was a blank. i think its really bad if you do.

also, just bc we called turn doesn't mean we HAVE to call this river.

if he bets the turn, he is betting the river with his whole range on any blank

So if you are going to fold the river when a complete blank rolls off you may as well just fold turn.

I snap call the river which I hpe isnt a big leak

11-17-2008 , 02:10 AM

TPTK77

veteran

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 2,438

Quote:

Originally Posted by jdaman

He is definitely not betting his entire range on the river.

Okay, if you say snap call, what hands do we beat which take this line?

11-17-2008 , 02:19 AM

jdaman

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 136

the thing is, when he raises flop his range is really narrow. Its either a set or a draw. Dont think he is raising any worse K except KTdd and KJdd.

On the turn he fires again. He has 45dd, KTdd,, KJdd, or sets. The other XdXd draws are checking behind this turn. I fold turn because even though he bets so small you can expect an allin on the river for another 40xbb.

BTW i meant I snap call river when the 3 comes, when I call turn.

I usually fold turn OOP in this reverse implied odds situation

11-17-2008 , 02:20 AM

mg0698

banned

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 9,432

Is folding flop a leak?

11-17-2008 , 02:21 AM

jdaman

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 136

Quote:

Originally Posted by TPTK77

ugh i don't think we can EVER fold turn given that it was a blank. i think its really bad if you do.

also, just bc we called turn doesn't mean we HAVE to call this river.

Can you explain why its bad to fold turn??

What range that we beat is betting the turn?

11-17-2008 , 02:35 AM

jdaman

centurion

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 136

Quote:

Originally Posted by mg0698

Is folding flop a leak?

You know.. I thought about this. I usually never fold these flops, because I always say to myself, villian can have fd!! But even if villian has an fd its probaly some sort of combo that has great equity against us

I always call these raises on the flop, but then I always end up folding the turn anyways. It really sucks OOP especailly against a nonagressive player.

Haha so first I wanna fold the turn, now I wanna fold the flop...

11-17-2008 , 02:52 AM

#10

punish15

adept

Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 994

Quote:

Originally Posted by mg0698

Is folding flop a leak?

against some players it definately is, against a loose-passive who we haven't seen make any moves I don't think it's too bad.

11-17-2008 , 03:55 AM

#11

blah-blah-blah

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 6,718

this is a flop fold or a river call given the river that fell. no way calling the flop/turn is good if you can't call a shove on this river.

11-17-2008 , 04:51 AM

#12

Buff Disciple

Carpal \'Tunnel

Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 6,151

Yeah, I either get it in on flop or fold flop. Seeing as how you say he hasn't gotten out of line, I like a flop fold. I am a station and even I think turn fold is good. Also I've noticed these tagfish types have ak in their range too, which makes this even more of fold.

That said if he raises his draws I have absolutely no prob getting in on flop.

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