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100 NL river call ok, or fold? 100 NL river call ok, or fold?

12-14-2013 , 01:20 AM
villain is a reg, as far as I am aware. not been playing 6max long.

do you bet turn?
as played should I be calling river or folding?

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PokerStars - $100 NL (6 max) - Holdem - 6 players
Hand converted by PokerTracker 4: http://www.pokertracker.com

MP: 100 BB (VPIP: 27.79, PFR: 23.21, 3Bet Preflop: 8.39, Hands: 357)
Hero (CO): 100 BB
BTN: 100 BB (VPIP: 12.50, PFR: 12.50, 3Bet Preflop: 0.00, Hands: 8)
SB: 108.35 BB (VPIP: 25.00, PFR: 22.92, 3Bet Preflop: 16.00, Hands: 50)
BB: 141.86 BB (VPIP: 26.79, PFR: 20.57, 3Bet Preflop: 8.43, Hands: 216)
UTG: 122.74 BB (VPIP: 41.46, PFR: 29.27, 3Bet Preflop: 16.67, Hands: 82)

SB posts SB 0.5 BB, BB posts BB 1 BB

Pre Flop: (pot: 1.5 BB) Hero has 7h 7c
fold, MP raises to 3 BB, Hero raises to 8 BB, fold, fold, fold, MP calls 5 BB

Flop : (17.5 BB, 2 players) 4s 9c 2h
MP checks, Hero bets 8.85 BB, MP calls 8.85 BB

Turn : (35.2 BB, 2 players) 9s
MP checks, Hero checks

River : (35.2 BB, 2 players) 8s
MP bets 19 BB, Hero calls 19 BB
12-14-2013 , 01:26 AM
Calling pre. And seldom making it 8 bigs with a 3b vs a 3x open, even IP.

Post is weird now that we've 3b. Fold river.
12-14-2013 , 01:30 AM
Would need a really good reason to 3bet pre, as played its a fold on river given he still can have up to 1010-QQ value betting, also unlikely he floated flop with a high then leads river when you check back the turn.
12-14-2013 , 01:41 AM
ok thanks... to be honest im new to cash, im an MTT grinder, trying to make the switch.

I though by 3b pre, i gain initiative in the hand, and being 6max i thought this is standard? no? what range of PPs should i be 3betting?

also 7 or 8bigs seems to be the standard 3bet from opponents, or even larger sometimes. should i be 3betting smaller in posistion??


Yes, that makes sense now, i see why i should fold river now, im just getting value towned , as what can he be bluffing with, as he would prob try showdown AQ+ etc.

Thanks for your replies!
12-14-2013 , 04:57 AM
I would rather bet turn small and check back river. less guessing.
12-14-2013 , 04:58 AM
What's your thoughts on the flop?
12-14-2013 , 06:21 AM
Yeah i guess small bet on turn would let me get to the river with a cheaper showdown. And stop him drawing to overcard outs.
12-14-2013 , 06:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TheHippo
What's your thoughts on the flop?
Thoughts on the flop, were ive probably still got the best hand, and betting for value and protection against his overcards.
Is that wrong in anyway?

Thanks
12-14-2013 , 10:17 AM
Flat pre. Betting turn for value/protection is the optimal play.
12-14-2013 , 10:28 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by regularblue
ok thanks... to be honest im new to cash, im an MTT grinder, trying to make the switch.

I though by 3b pre, i gain initiative in the hand, and being 6max i thought this is standard? no? what range of PPs should i be 3betting?

also 7 or 8bigs seems to be the standard 3bet from opponents, or even larger sometimes. should i be 3betting smaller in posistion??


Yes, that makes sense now, i see why i should fold river now, im just getting value towned , as what can he be bluffing with, as he would prob try showdown AQ+ etc.

Thanks for your replies!
Definitely not a standard 3b IP in 100bb cash. Stack sizes obviously make it a more 3-bettable hand in MTTs. There are villains I'll 3b! this hand with (whales), but mainly for isolation purposes.

Sizing is fine. 9x is standard and I definitely wouldn't be going any smaller than 8x. It's not a big deal, though.

River is a pretty elementary fold.
12-14-2013 , 11:53 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kangal_
Definitely not a standard 3b IP in 100bb cash. Stack sizes obviously make it a more 3-bettable hand in MTTs. There are villains I'll 3b! this hand with (whales), but mainly for isolation purposes.

Sizing is fine. 9x is standard and I definitely wouldn't be going any smaller than 8x. It's not a big deal, though.

River is a pretty elementary fold.
Ok, yeah that makes alot of sense, i guess my reasoning for 3betting is somewhat flawed in respects to how deep we are.

Yeah i couldnt understand how i would 3bet any less, if i did then I'm getting called 100% of the time, and that isnt always what i want when i 3bet as a bluff, with the same sizing.

In review, i can see how the river was a pretty hideous call. In game, i clearly wasn't thinking optimally.

Thanks for your reply!
12-17-2013 , 09:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kangal_
River is a pretty elementary fold.

lol
12-18-2013 , 12:19 AM
Flat pre

Probably calling river.

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12-18-2013 , 08:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cashy
lol
What do you think villain's range is OTR?
12-18-2013 , 08:37 AM
considering that you fold 100% of the time?
a million floats

3betting/cbetting is mind-blowing bad if you think you can't profitably call this river against this villain
12-18-2013 , 10:03 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kangal_
Definitely not a standard 3b IP in 100bb cash. Stack sizes obviously make it a more 3-bettable hand in MTTs. There are villains I'll 3b! this hand with (whales), but mainly for isolation purposes.

Sizing is fine. 9x is standard and I definitely wouldn't be going any smaller than 8x. It's not a big deal, though.

River is a pretty elementary fold.
If you fold this hand on the river after taking this line, what hands are you calling with?

River is an easy call, given it's pretty much the top of your flop bet/turn check range.

If for some reason you're checking back overpairs on the turn (which I don't think you should be), then I suppose you can fold 77 here.
12-18-2013 , 10:41 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Griffey24
If you fold this hand on the river after taking this line, what hands are you calling with?

River is an easy call, given it's pretty much the top of your flop bet/turn check range.

If for some reason you're checking back overpairs on the turn (which I don't think you should be), then I suppose you can fold 77 here.
I'm 100% not 3-bet, c-betting this hand vs a MP open though. I think it's pretty awful to do so without specific reads. If you're consistently 3-betting all sorts of middling pairs and garbage from the CO then it's certainly more of a call.

Can see the argument definitely for calling, but I don't mind being exploitable in this spot.
12-18-2013 , 11:25 AM
Calling pre-flop. Wouldn't bet the flop, but as played I would call.
12-19-2013 , 02:10 PM
fold pre as played call river.
12-19-2013 , 02:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by HeyOver
fold pre as played call river.
Fold pre?...
12-19-2013 , 02:26 PM
he jes' trollin'
12-19-2013 , 07:31 PM
u dont want to call 77 to on openraise with ppl to act behind just too weak and when u call ppl put u on a small pp so u dont make any money if u hit a set and also he can barrel bluff u easy as we know what u hold. u have to fold when someone 3bets and when u hit a set ur not even sure u have the best hand u can be against a higher set and lose a buy in for nothing.
12-19-2013 , 08:39 PM
cba
12-20-2013 , 03:31 AM
definitely not folding river
12-20-2013 , 07:23 AM
Bet the turn and as played call river.

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