5handed, effective stacks like 4.3k, everyone has at least 3k on the table. Villain is very aggressive, 3bets a ton himself, and likes to 3bet oop and c/rai alot of flops. He is also capable of taking tricky lines and running big bluffs. For those on ipoker, its Vinorosso, it is obv fine if u dont want to talk about his game but more of this situation in a vacuum, also I stacked him like 5 min before on another table i defended AQQx in bb against his button open, flop AAQ with fd, c/r him and he pushed with AKxx. In general we have been pretty aggressive against eachother.

To the hand:
UTG folds, CO opens to 70, Hero on the button with Q K A 3 and reraise pot to 240. SB folds, Villain(bb) calls 220 cold, CO calls

Villain is somewhat loose pf, so im kind of putting him on all kinds of rundowns and doublepairs, some doublesuited stuff, possibly AAxx

Flop 7 5 9 (730)
bb checks, CO checks, Hero checks (who likes a cbet? what if i had the nut FD instead?)
Turn 6
bb bets 365, CO folds, Hero calls
River J (1460)
bb checks, Hero ?

Do you think a valuebet is too thin here, if not what size? Please comment on earlier streets also, will share my own thoughts later.

If the villain is really as aggro as I imagine, then I like a value bet to induce a bluff. Something like 1000 should be good and if I'm betting then I'm calling c/rai 100% of the time.

I think a K high flush eventually finds a call here. J high- probably folds but if villian is tricky could c/r. What's your action if you get raised? Ugggghhh.


LL

Mr. Go

We were posting at the same time. Do you think the half pot bet on turn was str8t feeler bet?

River check is skeert of any flush??


LL

seems like he likes to checkraise alot so checking behind that flop seems good. most people dont lead much at all in this kind of spot so check is good IMO.


I wouldnt think twice about valuebetting this river. I might raise turn so i can go allin on the river though some random % of the time. I dont know what to read from his half pot bet on the turn. The problem with this line is that, if hes any good, and he seems to be judging from OP, is that he is going to CRAI on this river alot and its really difficult to guess his frequencies here ( he probably isnt going to valuecrai a worse hand but who knows).
Basically with this hand here i play the preflop and flop the same and on the turn/river my stack would most likely be in the middle at some point.

anything other than a bet seems really bad here. Vbet it and hope he doesnt CR. If he does CR Im probly calling this down as it is a 3bet pot and people get spazzy in 3bet pots.

Bet about half pot IMO, and probably fold to a c/r, which I don't think it likely given the turn action.

without any meta reads of the level from a plo100donk)

I would definitely vb here sometimes, but as a minority play. Shooting from the hip, I'd say ~20%

Too much and you can expose yourself to too may check raises. Too little and you could be getting value owned.

Turn bet could be anything: air, set, two pair, small flush, straight/draw...

A/K high flush is likely betting for value. It also depends on the metagame and if OP has been betting/raising light. Not that the villain is incapable to check the nuts to induce a bluff but we don't have any relevant info to make that determination yet.

Actually I'd bet out smaller to give villain impression that there's fe. And I wouldn't consider a river bet thin.

Villian really is obscenely aggro but also very good and in my experience of playing with him he is not the type to get too tricky. I see that you have edited the op but against vino i VB for sure and I stuggle to fold. I think u see a SF here more than the AdXd flush, you never see the KdXd flush - ofc u will see the lone Ad here plenty.

as an aside i was playing with villian yday and he called a 4b deep oop in a hu pot and just open folded the flop - i think he was tilting at the time

My feeling b4 I read this was that here was no point in a river bet. Aainst a straight forward villian, yes, cuz you can safely fold a c/r. Against a tricky player, it is better to showdown your pretty darn goot hand rather than put yourself in the position of folding the best and calling with the worst.

Given your info, prob bet and call.

LL

this.

although i would bet a bit smaller, ~800. and if i do decide to bet, i'm 100% calling a raise.

flop is a check back for sure

Your hand is so polarised to a decent flush that this looks a great spot for him to check raise with the nuts(or A flush), if he knows you vb light.
This really depends on the dynamics between you two.
If im betting, its for the slight possibility of getting called by worse, but much more likely to get him to bluff.
VS v good trickier players, I don't mind just checking behind, as he wont call with worse and should realise you're not folding to a shove.

if he has the NF and is good, he should be c/r it here. then its just a question of how good his frequencies are to include bluffs and how he thinks you'll react w non-nut flushes which is what your hand looks like.

Yes. When OP just calls the turn, villian has to assume non-nut hand at that point. NF raises to protect. NO critisicm of OP play. Calling is what his hand does.


LL

Sets aren't gone from op's range though. villain checks non board pairing rivers to induce-he has nuts/2nd nuts more than you guys are implying; still not enough to make a value bet too thin considering he's calling most lower flushes..your sizing should really depend on whether you want villain to c/r or not, which admittedly i'm not sure of.

Edit: this is one of the most interesting hands i've seen in a while, good post jeans

i think i check cause im not willing to call a check raise here

noone seems ot be thinking about what he thinks you have, surely he's good enough to know you are not likely to be bet folding here?

kind of irrelevant...the question being asked is whether or not you can profitably value bet in this spot

Villian bet half pot on turn when flush fills. OP calls. If villian is as good as we think he is, he knows OP can't have the nut flush. Nut hands raise to protect. Non-nut doesn't have that luxury. Villian knows OP will struggle to call a check raise on river.


LL

^^^ well put. i think vbetting is standard here.

c/r smells more like a naked ace than anything else here. He knows you're likely to call a river barrel with your moderate flushes, but will have trouble dealing with a c/r, and if it checks through well whatever he got off cheap.

That being said I don't know how much value there is on the river here for you, especially if he's ever checking with better hands.

I can definitely have the nut flush here, raise to protect from what? dont think he is firing a set for half pot on the turn? I guess he could to get me off a straight but very unlikely

Point is well taken. Me= skeertycat. I don't want to give any random/stupid hand the chance to draw out. Probably a leak.

LL

I'd probably flat the turn with the nut flush like 9 times out of 10. Just because of what is said about hero never being able to have the nutflush since he just flatted the turn.