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******OFFICIAL STARS REGULARS THREAD****** ******OFFICIAL STARS REGULARS THREAD******

04-19-2013 , 06:10 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Praetor
Whats the best response and information we can give to mexican_natis to respond to Stars in that discussion?
Quote:
Originally Posted by joeri
I've answered this in that thread:

Great question Natis!

Rake on PLO is almost double the rake of NLH. If on a limit the rake constitutes 15bb/100, then the average winrate of a player is -15bb/100. If there are two 0bb/100 "winners" on a 6 max table, that means that the other 4 players will ALL have to loose about 22bb/100. This is actually pretty hard to do in a game where hand equities run close. Also a new player to the game won't stand a chance, because there is very little room for error. New players will just give up on PLO too soon, nobody will be able to move up and the growth of plo will start into a decline.
With the current VIP system of stars, the rakeback of beginning players is really low. And to be able to actually beat SSPLO you need the rakeback. The vast majority of new enthusiast will not make in in the PLO field.

In the past the level of play in general on PLO has been pretty low. The game spiked in polulairity. As the game matures, there are an increasing number of regulars and the level of play rises quickly. In a game with a very high (relative) rake, more and more people will start loosing and the popularity of PLO will start to decline.

PLO has very high variance (stdev/100 tends to be about 2,5 times nlh variance). As a result it takes an incredible amount of hands before you can actually determine what kind of winrate you actually should expect (hundred thousends, maybe even millions). There are also very different winning strategies that tend to work for PLO regulars, whereass winning players play very similar stats in NLH. As a result of the above, it is way less clear in plo who actually has the edge in a game. Because of this fact, you see a lot more tables going wich are shorthanded with regs or even full regs tables. As time progresses and regs realise they just can't beat the rake in nowadays games, these games will be cut first and the predetory feel of plo will increase fast (like nlh).

Another result of the high variance of PLO is that there will always be winners running really good. The extreme lucky or unlucky stretches are just way bigger compared to NLH. You will have to be carefull with conclusions like, Stars: "player xyz played 500.000 hands of limit x and won 4bb/100", so this shows it is still possible to beat this limit for a reasonable amount. Statements of this kind shouldn't mean a thing to you.


Still thinking of coming up with other arguments or better wording, but if you have ideas on top of mine, please contribute!
Can any of you guys add to this or suggest some other potential questions that may get brought up regarding the PLO rake? Just want to make sure I'm not missing any important info that I should be aware of. Also can someone tell Blopp to clear his pm inbox on here, it's full.
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04-22-2013 , 07:12 AM
Hey Guys, just wondered.. Is het known who n0d1ceb4by is?
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04-22-2013 , 08:59 AM
Hey guys,

I've been invited to the stars meetings last minute. I'll be sure to read over everything that has been suggested to Natis. I've also read the threads on hu cap, rake etc.

Feel free to PM me.
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04-22-2013 , 10:29 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane Stewart
Hey guys,

I've been invited to the stars meetings last minute. I'll be sure to read over everything that has been suggested to Natis. I've also read the threads on hu cap, rake etc.

Feel free to PM me.
Great news! Have fun there!
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04-22-2013 , 11:05 AM
+1, very good decision by Stars.
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04-22-2013 , 12:05 PM
Well it's because chadders is in hospital, so they weren't like "ok plo needs more representation" but yeah at least they
did open his place.

Last edited by cbt; 04-22-2013 at 12:12 PM.
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05-08-2013 , 04:00 AM
Looking for people to play HU 4 - 6 tables at either 1/2 or 2/4, if interested msg me on Skype, my info is in my 2+2 profile. ~
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05-08-2013 , 01:01 PM
Guys, anyone playing any/much 5card currently? Would like to try and get more 3/6 - 5/10 tables running daily if possible, happy to grind 2/4 too but would rather these two limits.
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05-08-2013 , 06:28 PM
Anyone else had issues with the last hand they played when server when down ? The amount of money coming from than hand is missing from my cashier.
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05-08-2013 , 06:58 PM
i won a 3.5k pot on the hand it froze, we both started with 2k, shoulda returned with 3.7k and when it reconnected we both had original stacks
(2k)
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05-08-2013 , 07:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by YaAaRnY
i won a 3.5k pot on the hand it froze, we both started with 2k, shoulda returned with 3.7k and when it reconnected we both had original stacks
(2k)
uff.

do you have the hh# & did you have time to take a screen shot?

email stars about that
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05-08-2013 , 07:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing
Looking for people to play HU 4 - 6 tables at either 1/2 or 2/4, if interested msg me on Skype, my info is in my 2+2 profile. ~
Can do 4x 3/6 if you want
******OFFICIAL STARS REGULARS THREAD****** Quote
05-08-2013 , 07:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by YaAaRnY
i won a 3.5k pot on the hand it froze, we both started with 2k, shoulda returned with 3.7k and when it reconnected we both had original stacks
(2k)
I email them with a screen shot pretty quickly after it happened and got that answer, they are probably overloaded with emails?

Hello,

Thank you for contacting PokerStars.

PokerStars has recently experienced some server connection
issues. Our
programming team has been made aware. At this moment, cash games
are running
and tournaments will restart as soon as possible. We sincerely
apologize for
any inconvenience caused.

We will be considering refunds for materially affected players.
"Materially
affected" means you missed a considerable number of hands and
lost a
significant portion of your chip stack due to blinds and antes.
If you
believe you were materially affected by this issue, please email
us with the
following subject line:

"REFUND: T#_________, $X+Y, User ID"

Where "________" is the Tournament ID, "X+Y" is the buy-in of the
tournament, and "USERID" is your PokerStars User ID.

For example, "REFUND: T#123456780, $20 + 2, KidJoker"

For multiple tournament refund requests, please note additional
tournaments
in the text of your email. For example:

T#123456780, $20 + 2
T#123456781, $10 + 1,
T#123456782, $50 + 5
etc.

If you do not know the Tournament ID, you can find it in the
PokerStars
software using the playing audit feature. From the PokerStars
Lobby screen,
select:

'Requests -> Playing History Audit...'

Please also be aware that your refund request may take a few days
to be
processed.

We appreciate your patience and understanding.

Regards,

Bianca
Pokerstars Support Team
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05-08-2013 , 08:33 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaKing
Looking for people to play HU 4 - 6 tables at either 1/2 or 2/4, if interested msg me on Skype, my info is in my 2+2 profile. ~
added you at skype.

will play 2/4 or 3/6 4-6tables.
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05-10-2013 , 11:59 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigAisaOK
Guys, anyone playing any/much 5card currently? Would like to try and get more 3/6 - 5/10 tables running daily if possible, happy to grind 2/4 too but would rather these two limits.
I'm going to play a lot during scoop.
Just open tables, or join open ones. Most regs don't table select on 5card, at least compared to normal plo
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05-11-2013 , 06:45 AM
I think if Insyder wasn't in this thread all the time asking 1billion questions about which friggin' chair and/or mouse to buy he might actually play some poker, rather than grimming non regulars for 8bbs everytime they sit to play him HU.

Sick life bro, sick life.
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05-11-2013 , 06:53 AM
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05-11-2013 , 08:09 PM
stars reply about the hand i played, when it froze





Hello rupert,

Thank you for your patience in awaiting our reply.

Please be aware that during a server crash, there is a chance that hands "seen" by players (and played out with hand history numbers) may not be communicated properly to the PokerStars database. This appears to be what happened in your case as I will demonstrate later in this email.

The "PokerStars server" is not a single computer. There is the game server, the main database server, and a number of peripheral servers like dispatchers, entropy servers, etc.

The main point is that the gameplay happens in the game server, but NOTHING is written to the database server until the end of the hand. Consequently, if the database server crashes while the game servers remain operational, players will be able to continue playing their current hand. There's no inter-server communication, except at the completion of the hand.

If the hand cannot be written to the database once it is complete on screen, since we do not have a record of it, unfortunately it cannot be considered as actually having occurred.

Refer to Rule 6 of our Ring Game Rules:

"All transactions, including pots won and lost, are posted to your PokerStars account at the completion of each hand. In the event of a server crash that for any reason causes a hand to be incompletely recorded in the PokerStars database, all of that hand's participants’ accounts will be restored to the way they were at the beginning of the hand. Such a hand shall be declared a misdeal, with all associated blinds, antes and bets returned to the players."

In summary, the PokerStars client may display the hand as 'complete', but during server issues, a hand that appears 'complete' on screen might not be able to be written to our database. Hands that cannot be written to the database will be subject to misdeal status as above.

Here is your last RECORDED hand before the server crash:

As you can see, you started your first hand with the amount of chips you finished the last hand with.

Any hand that you may have observed in between these hands was not recorded to our database and is therefore regarded as void as discussed.

We apologise for the inconvenience created by the server issues. We hope you understand that since we do not have records of the hand, that declaring the hand as a misdeal, is the most reasonable action to take.

Please let us know if you have any other questions, and thank you for playing at PokerStars.



the hand that played out, i made a hero call, and the player typed in chat, wtf nice turn call , so deff the whole table seen it , another player commented aswell after the site came back up

Dunoo know what to say , does that seem fair?

Last edited by YaAaRnY; 05-11-2013 at 08:35 PM.
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05-12-2013 , 12:42 AM
i saw the hand...but if thats what their ToS says..you can not win..
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05-12-2013 , 12:43 AM
yayaRny, , doens't seems fair, but they are doing what they have on rules, so even if doesnt seems fair, they are following the rules, which seems ''honest/fair''. i mean, isn't fair, but theres a logic behind what they are doing.

weird spot, would be very pissed in your shoes.
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05-12-2013 , 07:06 AM
Did Stars alter their stance on the seating script yet? I think that right now having it banned should be our top priority rather than getting rake decreased, which is not gonna happen anyway.
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05-12-2013 , 07:20 AM
I'm starting to get pretty pessimistic, but we'll see

Krmont, have they made any progress with the collusion ring who had seating scripts?
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05-12-2013 , 07:23 AM
Also: we should get a list of users of the script together, to check if there is anything (even more) shady going on.
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05-12-2013 , 02:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by dhcg86
I'm interested in getting PLO coaching. Specifically heads up cash. Please send me a PM or am email. I use gmail with

Spoiler:
same screenname. No this is not a troll
Looking for people who can beat up to 1000nl
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05-12-2013 , 04:32 PM
I also lost a big pot during the disconnection problems. No meening to claim this money back?
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