VPIPs will get higher at 5 card. As long as everyone is limpy, passive pf, that is good as you be able to play most of your hands otb. If it is aggro pre for some reason, go 4 card and the greater pf/flop edge.

ha that was pretty good. However, I think that Gus is the type of person that just cant convey his thoughts very well. Not a teacher, but a doer.

lol at that video.

That is hilarious hahaha. "I have no idea what he has... I call."

Also playing this. Never played 5 card before, but am always choosing 5 because I don't think anyone else has played much 5 card, and I'd imagine in general the button has more inherent advantage with 5 cards than 4.

does your answer change with stack sizes?

i thought this was funny. (this takes place at plo 1k, im in a good mood for a change coz im winning)

GodlikeRoy: finishing session
GodlikeRoy: though if you REALLY want me too
GodlikeRoy: i can stay
(roy bought in for 30BB)
Dealer: brodys1, it's your turn. You have 8 seconds to act
hero: yeah PLS STAY
hero: !!! you are so nice
hero: god bless you
GodlikeRoy: sigh
(ROY REBUYS TO 100BB WTF ?!?!?!?!?)

GodlikeRoy: oh wait i had auto reload on, i would never want to play 100bbs OOP to the feared <insert my SN here>
Dealer: brodys1, it's your turn. You have 8 seconds to act
GodlikeRoy: just too scary
GodlikeRoy: gl all

A Heads-Up for HS PLO players at PokerStars:

2+2 has elected by poll a panel of five players to meet with us on the Isle of Man later this month to discuss possible rake changes amongst other things. The 2+2 names of those five players are:
Hood
Klairic
xPeru
krmont22
chisness

It may be in your best interests to open a dialog with one or more of these representatives to ensure that high stakes players are represented in the meetings.

zacharr, cool story, as usual.

//

I think its awesome that Stars is flying people out there to discuss their changes. What a great company/site. Krmont, best of luck getting your points across, and you seem like a great choice to represent the plo community.

god bless you Karls_Hungus

krmont22: go off track and search for boomswitch/doomswitch room in stars HQ and take a pic

2nd krmont22 being a great representative

haven't been able to 100% follow the discussion on this cuz my internet sucks but just to get it straight in my head- only the supernova elite guys, and the others who play like <26 (or w/e it is)vpip are negatively affected by the rake changes, right?

if so, are they the guys going as reps for 2+2?
ie. are the ppl who have spoken out about the changes the angry voices of the few who needed the old rake system to make a good living?

Yea as I got shorter, I switched to 4.

Adiprene, it doesn't matter whether you benefit from the change or not. PokerStars pays less money back to players after the changes, that's the problem. It's true that very loose player might benefit from the change, but they should benefit even more, if the change from dealt to contributed would've been done the fair way. (= total amount paid to players as bonuses would remain the same). It's not just about VPIP, but if you're VPIP is around 25-30 at 6max you're still very likely to get a little less rake. You have to play really loose to benefit.

I don't think any of those representatives would even want the old system back, most people realize that dealt doesn't really make any sense and change to contributed is a positive thing in itself (if done properly, not like stars is planning to)

ok ty chinz, didn't know they were giving less back.

This is incorrect -- basically any regular with winning stats baring a very few exceptions will end up losing out. VPIP isn't the only determining factor but rather it depends on how much money goes into the pot postflop, so things like wtsd etc are stats that should be looked at. Basically every reg ranges from -25% to +5% or so from what I've seen in terms of PLO rakeback percentages.

No, I don't believe so. I think one or two of them are very casual players, and the range of players/stakes/games is very diversified. The panel is a very good representation of the entire player pool on Stars. And even if they aren't, they seem to have the ability to think well for the long term of the game and represent all facets of the community sufficiently (incl. recreational players).

No, none of the people going are trying to get the old system back. I believe everyone is on the same page in that they agree that it should remain WC (or perhaps WTA) but are trying to advocate for lower rakes so that the games remain beatable and winning players aren't ostracized.

Krmont22 is a very good rep both for PLO and the general poker community.

Reps chosen were chisness, Hood, Klairic, krmont22 and xPeru.

OP in this thread gives quick description/background of those guys:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...stars-1148168/

Hood was missing from that thread, here's his:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...-vote-1150163/

Current discussion thread is here:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28...tions-1147161/

Thanks for the support everyone! I will do my best to help the entire community the most. Trust me, the boomswitch room is my number 1 priority

I would guess that 90% of winning players lost money on the change to WC. I lose about 10% of my rakeback from the changes, and I don't really foresee any changes from the meeting impacting me directly. My goal is to fix the "rake traps" and other issues with the entire ecosystem.

+1 to everything that Roy said. I've been silently following the whole discussion throughout the tons of threads and I'm very pleased that the instinctive anger at the beginning was shaped into something much more constructive. Krmont has a lot to do with this and I believe he has very good ideas about the long term health of the games. Fingers crossed something positive comes out of this meeting.

In all honesty, the panel does seem to be unfairly representative of the overall stars demographic in that the majority are supernova elites, but it makes sense as they are the only ones willing to put the effort into going.

I was fairly concerned, but it seems that they have the right idea(at least krmont does) in that his main agenda is to lower rake all round, rather than just rewarding the highest volume players.

I trust in krmont. I think the main part is, that stars is paying 30%(???) less rakeback to the players.
I don't care who get's the money, as far as it's getting back into the player pool.

Playing 5/10 PLO at pca. 4 ways to flop. Utg leads ~400 and I have 2 ppl behind ~3k+ deep. I fold. Last to act and utg are friends and put in the 400 and run it twice. I am right to throw a fit, correct?

Yes

yup

ya thats ridiculous