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Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job

06-03-2008 , 04:41 PM
I always check references, but I've never verified education. Then again, you don't really have to be educated to work for me...
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-03-2008 , 05:05 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by howzit
call these people back non-stop until you get a job.
In a thread full of good ideas, in my opinion this is the best one. People who are less aggressive in their follow-up during the search often lose out to people who aren't shy. People who may be less talented but more persistent.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kmak
So you were too lazy to go to college and now don't want to live with the repercussions? Sure, go ahead and lie about it....
And this is easily the worst. Just dumb.

I too find education verification to be pretty rare, particularly among small-mid companies. Ones that are huge, red tape-laden beasts like AmEx or Intel are more likely to go through with this. Of course I'm sure it's industry specific too.
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06-03-2008 , 06:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by miajag
Stuff like this always surprises me. I can't recall any employer ever confirming things (at least with my knowledge), or even contacting my references. Like after I've gotten jobs I've called my references to let them know and thank them and they're like "oh, they never called me but you're welcome anyway!" Maybe in the legal field they just trust people more?
It was a low level actuarial position. You're right that OP's employer probably won't verify things the way my employer did. But they've got to verify a degree that was required to get the job, right?
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-03-2008 , 07:18 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by miajag
Stuff like this always surprises me. I can't recall any employer ever confirming things (at least with my knowledge), or even contacting my references. Like after I've gotten jobs I've called my references to let them know and thank them and they're like "oh, they never called me but you're welcome anyway!" Maybe in the legal field they just trust people more?
weird - smaller firms for the most part?

most larger companies / firms in most professional fields (i think) outsource backgroudn checks to companies that do a standard criminal, employment history (just dates) and education verification. i know for sure in finance, and at fortune 500s i've worked at. i'd imagine any biglaw firm would.

for example friend of mine got asked about his HS gpa (was a bulge bracket i-bank verification), and for higher positions firms will secure the services of kroll to do a background check (also for top b-schools they hire kroll to verify admitted applicant info)
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-03-2008 , 10:39 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmak
thx but paid my own way through college and grad school
uhh if you did this then you know that its certainly not the norm. you either:

1) found a way to make a lot of money for someone of college age
2) worked a lot during school and took out loans
4) had a great scholarship(s)

1 and 4 are neither common nor guaranteed
2 is possible i guess? i still think you'd have a really hard time without any financial assistance (getting a co-signer for a loan as an example)

regardless, college and grad school forgot to teach you how not to be a douchebag
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06-03-2008 , 10:46 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by qdmcg
uhh if you did this then you know that its certainly not the norm. you either:

1) found a way to make a lot of money for someone of college age
2) worked a lot during school and took out loans
4) had a great scholarship(s)

1 and 4 are neither common nor guaranteed
2 is possible i guess? i still think you'd have a really hard time without any financial assistance (getting a co-signer for a loan as an example)

regardless, college and grad school forgot to teach you how not to be a douchebag
and where did you go to school that you didn't learn how to count to three?

In case you are interested, the answer is:
2) worked a lot during school, went to state school, took out no loans; worked three years before going back to grad school, used savings and loans to pay for it (with no cosigner).

And as far as being a douchebag, OP expected to be bashed by morally upstanding posters, didn't want to disappoint.
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-04-2008 , 12:17 AM
It sucks that some companies still cherish a bachelors degree over a heap load of actual experience. It makes no sense when you analyze it, but it is still all too common.

I would not encourage you to lie about it, as it could lead to consequences down the road, but you have to do what you have to do.

I would say the percentage of jobs that should REQUIRE a college degree is less than 1%. Almost any job can be done with related experience.
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-04-2008 , 12:19 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Williams
I've never done this, but I've heard stories of people who will work for free the first week just to show the employer that they can get the job done. Just a thought.
I have taken jobs in the past where I accepted a lower salary initially on the condition that I was who I said I was and proved it. Of course my salary more than doubled in the first 18 months there, so I caught up pretty quickly.

Not a bad gambit if the employer is honest and you are confident in your abilities. I don't know about offering yourself for free though. In reality for anything but a Mom and Pop shop that is a huge morass of paperwork nightmares that most people would reject to just avoid thinking about.
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-04-2008 , 12:21 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmak
So you were too lazy to go to college and now don't want to live with the repercussions? Sure, go ahead and lie about it....
So if someone went and worked for 4 years in the related industry, working 40-50 hours a week, would they be less qualified or more qualified then the kid who spent the last 4 years in college to do the job?

I suggest most people spend as much time in college as they can so they can avoid the real world. So who is really being lazy?
Job Resumes and Apps: Faking it to get a job Quote
06-04-2008 , 08:42 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by kmak
and where did you go to school that you didn't learn how to count to three?

In case you are interested, the answer is:
2) worked a lot during school, went to state school, took out no loans; worked three years before going back to grad school, used savings and loans to pay for it (with no cosigner).

And as far as being a douchebag, OP expected to be bashed by morally upstanding posters, didn't want to disappoint.
touche, i had a #3 scenario that i edited out.

however -- working 40hrs/week (this is tough to do while in school, but doable i'll assume) at something like 10/hr won't even clear 20k/yr. i agree that the grad school part is doable once you're out of school and can get a much more decent salary to start saving with, but isn't tuition at most places so high that 20k/yr isn't going to cover your expenses/tuition?
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06-04-2008 , 10:29 AM
OP,

Don't lie, it's a bad idea and silly. The reason you're not finding a job so far is almost surely that you're approach is flawed rather than the fact your resume lacks the degree.

You should be TALKING to people and convincing them to look at your portfolio and meet with you for 20 minutes for an interview. If you've freelanced you definitely should be talking to the person who you reported to, as well as EVERYONE who you worked with. They should know other places that could need work, etc.

You have a good portfolio. You have experience. That's all one of your contacts need to say to someone looking for a designer to get you an interview. When they finally do see your resume and if they ask about your degree, just tell them you are in the process of getting one. No big deal.

Oh, it looks like you're in Minneapolis? I just moved here and am just starting to look for an account position in advertising (have been in advertising for 4+ years). I'd be happy to look over your portfolio if you want and discuss things with you. Although I lack quality contacts to send you to atm (but that could change in the future). Tbh, I always evaluated designers on their past work, ability with InDesign (learn our system quickly) current attitude/attention to detail, and vibe (can they work well with our team). I couldn't care less about what it said on their resume.

Yugoslav

Last edited by The Yugoslavian; 06-04-2008 at 10:51 AM.
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06-04-2008 , 11:36 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by markksman
So if someone went and worked for 4 years in the related industry, working 40-50 hours a week, would they be less qualified or more qualified then the kid who spent the last 4 years in college to do the job?

I suggest most people spend as much time in college as they can so they can avoid the real world. So who is really being lazy?
I understand your logic, but it seems pretty short term to me.

I think they are looking at potential as well, and the ability to promote this individual up from within. Does his current position really require a degree? Probably not. But will his position in 10 years require one? Probably.

Also, college degrees provide more value than just preparing someone to do a job, as you hinted to by comparing it to working 4 years in a related industry.

If someone has developed their critical thinking skills, can effectively work in teams, and also has a social network, you can teach that person how to do a job. And that person will have more potential. You are more likely to find these attributes in a college grad.
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