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Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread

07-11-2016 , 12:39 AM
How exactly are these animals providing emotional support?
Or more to the point, how are they providing more emotional support than could be provided by say a doll, a blanket, or a robot?
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 01:09 AM
Cs3,

Lots of people (esp in America) love their pets like children or best friends.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 01:21 AM
Because they've been trained to. Or trained themselves to.

I dont think the animal itself is providing anything of value, emotionally. The person has learned to derive value from the animal, and Im hypothesising the person could also learn to derive a similar level of support from an inanimate object.
Similar to (or maybe exactly like?) a young child who feels more safe while sleeping with a blankey, or is more confident at that doctor appointment while cuddling Mr Squiggly Bear.

(To be clear, im not talking traditional service animals, that provide a physical benefit, such as a dog that a blind person would use - referring strictly to emotional support here)
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 01:53 AM
^ I think that's true for pretty much any animal other than a dog. For example with cats the relationship is going on entirely in the head of the owner.

I don't claim to know enough about horses to make a judgement.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 02:45 AM
I think we've bred dogs that imitate human behavior or emotion.

Also, waifus provide lots of Japanese men with emotional support
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 03:23 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by grizy
I think we've bred dogs that imitate human behavior or emotion.
Yes, and also read it.

Dogs are a pack animal so they fit into the family like their missing pack, so the same process of feeling like they have a relationship is going on in their heads too.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 01:13 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cs3
Because they've been trained to. Or trained themselves to.

I dont think the animal itself is providing anything of value, emotionally. The person has learned to derive value from the animal, and Im hypothesising the person could also learn to derive a similar level of support from an inanimate object.
Similar to (or maybe exactly like?) a young child who feels more safe while sleeping with a blankey, or is more confident at that doctor appointment while cuddling Mr Squiggly Bear.

(To be clear, im not talking traditional service animals, that provide a physical benefit, such as a dog that a blind person would use - referring strictly to emotional support here)
Simple solution then would be to train them to do without the animal, right?
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 01:45 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cs3
I dont think the animal itself is providing anything of value, emotionally. The person has learned to derive value from the animal, and Im hypothesising the person could also learn to derive a similar level of support from an inanimate object.
Similar to (or maybe exactly like?) a young child who feels more safe while sleeping with a blankey, or is more confident at that doctor appointment while cuddling Mr Squiggly Bear.
Have you ever met a pet irl? Unlike inanimate objects, they actually respond to people. At least push for some sort of AI stuffed animal that responds similarly to a pet. And then train people to derive a similar level of support from your AI real doll as they do from their partner, since the partner itself isn't providing anything of value, emotionally; we've just learned to derive value from our partners.

I've never had a pet or been emotionally attached to an animal, but it seems like everyone here with a pet is choosing to save the life of their pet over that of a random human, so it sure seems like people get attached to their animals more strongly than they would an inanimate object (though I could see how this could work if you have the emotional life of a 4-year-old).

Last edited by gregorio; 07-11-2016 at 02:15 PM.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 01:50 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic
Simple solution then would be to train them to do without the animal, right?
Systematic treatment progression would probably run:

dog-->cat-->guinea pig-->gerbil-->turkey-->turtle-->snake-->spider
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 05:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dominic
Simple solution then would be to train them to do without the animal, right?
Exactly.
Problem solved.



Now maybe we can tackle those pesky oxygen tanks next.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 05:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by gregorio
Have you ever met a pet irl? Unlike inanimate objects, they actually respond to people.
You're telling me that a turkey or an iguana is going to respond in away that is connecting emotionally?
Anyway, have you seen the kind of dolls they make nowadays?

Quote:
(though I could see how this could work if you have the emotional life of a 4-year-old).
Sure, you could make an argument that in some ways the people who claim they need an ESA to function *do* have the emotional life of a 4-year old.
You make a good point there.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-11-2016 , 07:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by cs3
Exactly.
Problem solved.



Now maybe we can tackle those pesky oxygen tanks next.
Refilling them with helium too obvious a solution?
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-15-2016 , 03:23 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ
^ I think that's true for pretty much any animal other than a dog. For example with cats the relationship is going on entirely in the head of the owner.

I don't claim to know enough about horses to make a judgement.
I think cats have a relationship with their owners. Or at least pretend.

Cats seem like a terrible animal to try to control in a restaurant or plane.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-15-2016 , 04:31 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by golfnutt
I think cats have a relationship with their owners. Or at least pretend.
I really don't see it. They just ignore people.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-18-2016 , 11:55 PM
Breaking News: My hospital to crack down on ESAs after employees have been repeatedly bitten.

Quote:
animals are not permitted to visit or enter the hospital or clinic unless they meet service animal, animal therapy or personal pet visitation requirements. There are only two questions that can be asked about whether the dog is a service animal:

-Is the animal required because of a disability?

-What work or task has the animal been trained to perform? (The provision of emotional support, well-being, comfort or companionship does not constitute work or tasks for purposes of a service animal.)
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-19-2016 , 04:19 AM
If this keeps up, Mary's little lamb will be allowed to follow her to school one day.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-19-2016 , 07:34 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayTeeMe
Breaking News: My hospital to crack down on ESAs after employees have been repeatedly bitten.
Congrats! That is great news. EDIT to add: the first part, not the employees being bitten. Although, unfortunately, maybe that's what will be required to turn the tide on this silliness.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-20-2016 , 07:18 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by JayTeeMe
Breaking News: My hospital to crack down on ESAs after employees have been repeatedly bitten.
This shouldn't be. If a dog that doesn't have a propensity to bite (i.e. your smaller dogs) and they are regarded to be an ESA and does indeed bite then I don't think you can throw a blanket over all RSA dogs and say that they are banned. But if they are getting bitten by larger dogs that should not be categorised as an ESA (but even if they are) then they should be banned but I don't think again you can throw a blanket over all ESA dogs and ban them for the deeds of these larger dogs.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-20-2016 , 07:58 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by bundy5
This shouldn't be. If a dog that doesn't have a propensity to bite (i.e. your smaller dogs) and they are regarded to be an ESA and does indeed bite then I don't think you can throw a blanket over all RSA dogs and say that they are banned. But if they are getting bitten by larger dogs that should not be categorised as an ESA (but even if they are) then they should be banned but I don't think again you can throw a blanket over all ESA dogs and ban them for the deeds of these larger dogs.
He didn't say anything about the size of the dogs.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
07-20-2016 , 08:30 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by LektorAJ
I really don't see it. They just ignore people.
Cats are only compassionate to their people when their people are really down about things. They seem to have a sense for peoples' energies and react accordingly.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
08-06-2016 , 02:42 PM
How do ESA regulations factor into residential property leases?
Most places that you can rent are pretty strict about not allowing pets, and those that do charge a hefty pet rent fee.

Are ESA's exempt from lease terms? Or do property owners just have to charge something ridiculous like a $10,000 pet rent fee to keep out the emotional support animals?
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
08-06-2016 , 03:12 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rapini
He didn't say anything about the size of the dogs.
No ****. Not to mention my small dog will bite your face off while my large dog will only lick you. Dog sizism itt.

Knew a girl who had an ESA (dog) and went through a full interview process saying nothing then got let go when she showed up at work on day #1 with her ESA and refused to work without it. I have mixed feelings about the whole thing.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
08-06-2016 , 03:22 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by diddy!
Knew a girl who had an ESA (dog) and went through a full interview process saying nothing then got let go when she showed up at work on day #1 with her ESA and refused to work without it. I have mixed feelings about the whole thing.
Funny that she was able to go through the interview process without her crutch.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
08-06-2016 , 03:33 PM
Although they might not be required to by law, I think most places do not charge the pet rent for an ESA. My friend even moved into a place with her dog and was paying $40 extra pet rent; after she got him certified, they removed the extra charge without question.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote
09-09-2016 , 06:34 PM
Stories I have heard (no joke).

1) Someone wanted a letter for an Emotional Support Fish. So they could take their fish into restaurants and place it on the table.

2) Someone is scared of swimming and would an emotional support animal be allowed to go into the pool with the person to help alleviate their swimming anxiety.
Fabian's Piano Appreciation and ESA Scam Thread Quote

      
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