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Old 07-18-2008, 07:10 PM   #26
MikeyPatriot
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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Originally Posted by suzzer99 View Post
I admit there are a lot of ways he could beat me. But let's say keep pushing forward, trying to keep my hands and feet out of harms way. He's going to have to dodge my full weight every now and then. If I guess right on one of his dodges, and come down on him with 240 lbs. + momentum with my knee in his chest, he's probably going to have a hard time wriggling out of that, no?
Are you trying to tell me you're effective strategy is to squash him?

And yes, I do think he'd wriggle out of that.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:11 PM   #27
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

its not like he can't just bum rush u and tackle u to the ground.

basically if u get on the ground your probably screwed..your best bet would be to get him on his stomach somehow and sit on his lower back
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:11 PM   #28
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

I go 6'1" 245 lbs, I gotta think if I land a good shot, pretty much any 14 yr old kid is goin' down.

That being said... what are my chances of landing a good shot?
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:13 PM   #29
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

Speaking from personal experience, and in only a BJJ context, I've been submitted by a girl 30-40 pounds lighter than me, and I had a bit of clue of what I was doing. People who have never trained in some sort of combat sport really overestimate their abilities in a fight (unless, you know, they've fought a lot).
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:13 PM   #30
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

There is no great example cuz there aren't a whole lot of untrained 28 year olds taking on 14 year old MMA fighters. The only comparison is small adults taking on big/fat/huge adults
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:13 PM   #31
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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I go 6'1" 245 lbs, I gotta think if I land a good shot, pretty much any 14 yr old kid is goin' down.

That being said... what are my chances of landing a good shot?
Slim.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:14 PM   #32
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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Again, you're talking 25% or so weight difference, not 80% + height and reach advantage + adult vs. 14 year-old. And I'd be much more tentative to just box someone.

I admit there are a lot of ways he could beat me. But let's say keep pushing forward, trying to keep my hands and feet out of harms way. He's going to have to dodge my full weight every now and then. If I guess right on one of his dodges, and come down on him with 240 lbs. + momentum with my knee in his chest, he's probably going to have a hard time wriggling out of that, no?



If it's on anyone, the burden of proof is on the people like you who are 100% sure they're right. I'm not 100% sure I could take this kid. I'm just saying I don't buy that I have zero chance.

I think you're just overestimating how easy it will be to get him down and keep him there, while avoiding harm to yourself at the same time. I think if you end up in his guard, half guard, or even in side control, he'll probably find a way out or grab a limb. Your only chance imo is to get mount and hold it (which would be hard to do in the first place), or to knock him out standing.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:14 PM   #33
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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I go 6'1" 245 lbs, I gotta think if I land a good shot, pretty much any 14 yr old kid is goin' down.

That being said... what are my chances of landing a good shot?
probably <20%
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:14 PM   #34
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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I'm ******ed. Japan has a ton of freakshows. For instance:

http://youtube.com/watch?v=e2SqIkt0E7o
Ha that's awesome. Butter Bean won a few fights in his day. For his size he's a good athlete. But this version is looking what 350? And pretty immobile.

What's fascinating to me is the part about 3:20 where butter bean flops on him, but the little dude gets his leg wedged in there and gets out. I'd like to see how the dude gets out if butter bean gets over the leg instead of under it. But maybe that's the whole game.

I agree that certainly shows how it can be done and what the kid would try to do to me. I don't think butter bean had no chance however. If he lands that one haymaker, little dude probably crumples. And I think a slightly more mobile butter bean maybe does a little better. But yeah I think I'd bet on the little dude either way.

Last edited by suzzer99; 07-18-2008 at 07:25 PM.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:16 PM   #35
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

Weren't the early ufc fights without weight classes? I seem to remember some little brown dude submitting a giant in one of the first ones.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:16 PM   #36
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

I think I might have a shot..Ive done Muay Thai for a couple years and MMA for the last year or so..I only do it a few times a week so Im sure he is a lot better then me, especially on the ground, but I might be able to use my size (6'2 175ish) to at least neutralize a lot of his attacks. It would probably be boring fight since I might be playing defense alot and try to keep it standing where my height and reach would be helpful, but I think I might be able not lose for 3 rounds..
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:22 PM   #37
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

I think I'd go immediately with the full-on wild-eyed screaming playground-spaz-out windmill charge, throwing punches, kicks, elbows, knees, heads. Try to catch him off guard, maybe pin him against the fence, get him down with my knee or ass on on his chest or back before he knows what hit him. At least it would probably be over quick either way. I figure the more tired I get and the more he adjusts to whatever pitiful tactics I'm trying to use, the more his advantage goes up.

Actually now that I think about it, I'd have to try something like that. After 5-10 min. of solid fighting, I'd be so exhausted I'd probably just submit myself.

Can you tickle in MMA, like Matthew did to Joe on NewsRadio? Is it legal to break someone's finger? And if so is there kind a code to just not do it?

Last edited by suzzer99; 07-18-2008 at 07:28 PM.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:30 PM   #38
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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This always gets posted in these sorts of threads, but here's ~150 lbs Arturo Gatti boxing 200 lbs+ joes.

http://www.sherdog.net/forums/f7/art...weight-712724/

It's not perfect because it's just boxing, but technique = power. And if you have no technique it's hard to land anything to begin with.

And taking down this kid is the dumbest thing you could do. You will not be able to hold him down, and he will almost assuredly submit you if you stay there.

Also do you have one real world example of a big untrained dude beating a much smaller fighter? No? Weird, I wonder why.


only problem here is that arturo gotti is a grown ass man
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:32 PM   #39
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

suzzer,

I don't know what kind of shape you're in, but I assume you're out of since you made reference to weighing 240+. I would be surprised if you could make it more than 2-3 minutes of a fight.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:33 PM   #40
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

u guys r all on crack. This kid would absolutely destroy you. I've taken a couple yrs of muay thai, am in pretty good shape, and i'd be lucky to last 30 seconds with this kid, despite having 60 lbs on him. First of all, if you find yourself on the ground AT ALL, you're t-o-a-s-t. Doubt many of you have experience with submission moves, but it's not just strength you're talking about; this kid knows how to use leverage to his advantage and the second he got ahold of an arm or leg of yours you'd be tapping out. This is not up for debate.

So once you realize that the second you get taken off your feet you're done for (true), the question really is: can i stay on my feet for 3 rounds vs. this kid. Again, answer is a quick no ****ing way. The kid knows all he has to do is take you to the ground; doesn't matter if you're on top of him. I saw a wrestling bout between a huge guy in my fraternity (prob 240 lbs and strong; i think he was a 2nd stringer on the football team), and a 170 lb. varsity wrestler. The 240 lb. guy was basically lying on top of the wrestler, trying to keep him pinned down. The wrestler just smiled and -- (i don't even know what he did or how he did it ) -- but not 7 seconds later, he had the huge dude in a half nelson completely helpless basically tapping out.

Once ur on the ground w/ this MMA kind you're finished, and you don't stand a chance of staying on your feet unless your tactic is to run fast in the opposite direction.

I think a more interesting question is whether you could go 3 rounds with a 14-yo boxer (standard boxing rules, not MMA). There you at least stand a chance of landing a couple blows and hopefully weathering his weaker punches.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:33 PM   #41
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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only problem here is that arturo gotti is a grown ass man
O RLY? Care to show me all the available evidence of trained teenagers fighting grown men? You can't, so we can go with the next best alternative. Small dudes fighting big dudes.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:35 PM   #42
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

Mikey, I agree with that. We used to box in the neighborhood and I remember being pretty wiped after 3 min. And MMA has to be more taxing.

All the more reason for the playground spazout tactic. Although I've decided he might be expecting that as a possiblity. So I pretend I'm going to play defensive etc. move around a little. Then charge when I see an opening. I'll scream and do some other weird distracting things I haven't thought of yet.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:39 PM   #43
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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Strength has very little to do with being submitted by a skilled BJJ practitioner.
Naw, it's still pretty important. Maybe you can't see a difference when stronger guy has absolutely no skill, since both weak and strong BJJ experts will beat him, but when stronger guy starts training he will start beating weak BJJ expert long before reaching his skill level.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:39 PM   #44
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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O RLY? Care to show me all the available evidence of trained teenagers fighting grown men? You can't, so we can go with the next best alternative. Small dudes fighting big dudes.
sorry, i don't have the data handy? you want to call them analagous b/c in both situations the trained fighter has a weight disadvantage but has a superior level of technical skill, but you are overlooking the relative levels of strength. an untrained adult who has a significant weight advantage is almost definitely going to be much stronger than a 14 year old. as such the next best alternative is not a good method of comparison.


edit: despite giving up weight arturo gotti is going to be stronger than the average untrained person fighting him. the same will not be true for this kid if he is fighting an adult. i'm not questioning the kid's abilities, but you are overestimating his advantage

edit2: asking for evidence of trained teenage fighters against adults is weaksauce, btw. do i really need to go grab some data to indicate why the average adult will still be stronger than a 14 year old? note i said stronger, not in better physical condition

Last edited by tarheeljks; 07-18-2008 at 07:51 PM. Reason: typos, grammar
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:40 PM   #45
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

I still want to know if I can tickle him.

Also I plan to have absolutely horrible BO and bad breath. And I'll wear a banana hammock. And I'll make fun of his puny mustache. No way a 14-year old can block out all that stuff.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:40 PM   #46
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

what if the kid had a knife and i had a baseball bat?
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:46 PM   #47
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

For the longest time I didn't open that thread because I thought it was about trying to kill a bat with a knife, which seemed pretty silly to me.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:50 PM   #48
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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Naw, it's still pretty important. Maybe you can't see a difference when stronger guy has absolutely no skill, since both weak and strong BJJ experts will beat him, but when stronger guy starts training he will start beating weak BJJ expert long before reaching his skill level.
Right, all other things being equal, natural size and speed becomes important, but that clearly isn't relevant to this discussion.

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Originally Posted by tarheeljks View Post
sorry, i don't have the data handy? you want to call them analagous b/c in both situations the trained fighter has a weight disadvantage but has a superior level technical skill, but you are overlooking the relative levels of strength. an untrained adult who has a significant weight advantage is almost definitely going to be much stronger than a 14 year old. as such the next best alternative is not a good method of comparison.


edit: despite giving up weight arturo gotti is going to be stronger than the average untrained person fighting him, even if that person weighs more. the same will not be true for this kid if he is fighting an adult. i'm not questioning the kid's abilities, but you are overestimating his advantage

edit2: asking for evidence of trained teenage fighters against adults is weaksauce, btw. do i really need to go grab some data to indicate why the average adult will still be stronger than a 14 year old? note i said stronger, not in better physical condition
Strength isn't going to matter much in a fight with your average joe, which is what most of us here are. When you start talking about athletes or freaks of nature is when a size/strength advantage becomes more relevant.

The Arturo Gatti video wasn't a good choice, and I said that in the post. The Genki Sudo/Butterbean video has merits, however, and I don't see how you can simply write it off.
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Old 07-18-2008, 07:51 PM   #49
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

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suzzer,

I don't know what kind of shape you're in, but I assume you're out of since you made reference to weighing 240+. I would be surprised if you could make it more than 2-3 minutes of a fight.
Yeah, for me to win I would have to do it quick by KO..... the last thing I would wanna do is dodge takedowns, kicks, and punches.

I gotta get in range and land a bomb in the first few minutes.
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Old 07-18-2008, 08:01 PM   #50
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Re: Could you go 3 rounds with a 14yo MMA fighter?

Drake Dudley is kind of a funny name but, uh, don't tell him i said it.
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