At some point, you are barely able to notice the difference, and the cost goes up quite a bit.

LOL. I guess since my car cost way more than her ring, she's less important than my car. And compared to my house, she's nothing!!!

This is the dumbest logic I've ever seen.

No. It isn't about absolute value it is about relative value to the class of good. Generally people have normal TVs. Having a nice TV is a luxury. Assuming you drive a standard car then that it costs more than the ring isn't a factor. Now if you go out an buy a luxury car then that is different. Do you understand the difference between discretionary and necessary/quasi-necessary spending?

once you and your chick start having any marriage talk you need to start poisoning the diamond well. its much easier now than in years past because of how "earth friendly" women have become. talk about blood diamond and how it totally changed your world view...blah...blah...blah. talk about how many memories you could make with that money without raping the earth and killing babies or whatever. you have about a 10% chance of pulling this off but hey its more than worth it.

if she balks follow my diamond buying advice from earlier, its still the best advice on this thread.

now you have to start poisoning the wedding well...the cost of the diamond will look like pennies compared to the princess wedding shes always dreamed of. find her dad and tell him flat out that hes paying for that ****.

As always Henry is right (as is his GF of course) and most 2p2ers are idiots that have no clue about women, their thought process, nor their emotions.

The general consensus of the avg 2p2er here reminded me of this quip:

Diamonds are forever. If a girl won't last forever, why give her a diamond?

I guess henry's GF really does have her own account...

lol

I've dated a lot of girls who really were not that bright. That was fun because it was temporary. When it comes to marriage presumably we are talking considerably more long-term. Do you really want to spend every day with someone who is so slow and easy to manipulate that they fall for something so obviously transparent?

I can't respect someone that I can manipulate. Not going to marry someone that I can't respect. Is it really this hard to just not be cheap?

I'd wager that about 100% of women that sleep with you are gold diggers.

This is related to what I refer to as the R. Kelly Syndrome that affects all women with a mild form of ******ation which causes them to throw out all intellectual honesty and morality when it would inconvenience their lifestyle.







Girl 1- Here's your redbull and vodka! Oh did I tell you I found a website that lets you see where sex offenders live?

Girl 2- Yeah, that is soooo scary and disgusting. There is one like two blocks from here.

Girl 1- So gross, anyone who has sex with underage girls should be shot!

Girl 2- Yeah!

(....Now, usually, I don't do this but uh....Go head' on and break 'em off wit a lil' preview of the remix....)

Girl 1- OMG this is my jam!!!! let's go dance!!!!

Girl 2- Woo hoo! I love R. Kelly, he's soooooooo hot!

"slow and easy to manipulate" ??? who said it would be easy? this is super ninja blackbelt manipulation, not for the faint of heart. and even then i said youd be lucky to succeed 10% of the time. and who said anything about being cheap? i said spend the money on something else...how bout a private plane to monte carlo, diggs at the hotel de paris and dinner at louis XV. ive done it, its not cheap, and WAYYYYY better than any rock.

I'd just like to point out that the whole point of this thread is that everyone has different values and that all values are relative. Your point above, Henry, is a perfect example of this. You create your own dichotomy between two poles (luxury and necessity) with the one presumably relative and the other absolute. But the problem is that luxury and necessity are discursively-constructed terms and as such are a product of society and culture and even relative to different social units down to the individual.

My parents consider a TV to be a necessity and would go to great lengths to obtain one if theirs were to break. I, on the other hand, have never owned a TV. I consider internet connection to be a top priority. My parents, on the other hand, have never been on the internet, and can’t begin to understand how I have a computer and internet connection but no TV. Most Americans consider a car a necessity, while many Europeans don’t. Many Americans consider a balanced meal a necessity, while many people around the world would be happy with a bowl of rice.

People value different things and classes of things very differently for many different reasons. There is no absolute way to value anything, which is why this thread is so mind-numbingly banal. It’s like Henry is saying he likes the color blue and everyone is saying they like red and then you guys are arguing about who is “right.” This is a foolish argument, DUCY?

Now the real problem, as I see it, is if the man has one relative value and the woman has a different.

That was a really well written post... words like dichotomy and banal. You ruined it with the DUCY

100% serious question - are there women out there that you do respect? The reason I'm asking is because of a couple of comments you've made on here. I don't want to take your words out of context so I figured I'd just go ahead and ask.

FFK,

1. Did you see that his girlfriend posted in this thread? Either she is a twin separated at birth, one of his split personalities, or his soul mate. They are the same person. Still might not be up to his standards.

2. Your thoughts on R. Kelly?

She has to be smart enough for him and earn his respect, but also be a 10, and under the age of 25. Not many stay under age 25 forever.

That doesn't change my point. I actually do consider a TV a necessity or close to it despite not really watching much TV. I consider a car a necessity of sorts. That doesn't change the fact that among all goods we consider necessities there are different price levels. I have to abandon the TV example because I'm not up on TV technology and trends. But say something like a coat. A coat is a necessity in many climates but a $2000 coat is not so it is a luxury. A reliable car is usually a necessity but a Porsche is a luxury. A computer is probably a necessity but a top of the line Alienware machine is a luxury. So what someone considers a necessity isn't really relevant what matters is where on the spectrum you shop when it is stuff for you.

I enjoy blowing money on fun **** so I see nothing wrong with this. What I don't understand is if you can feel comfortable blowing $60-90k on a trip how do you suddenly become so thrifty when it comes to a ring? Is that extra $8-12k really going to break you or even mean anything to you? If it is should you really be leasing private jets?

*sigh* As usual (lately, at least), Henry is right on.

It's really very simple. The vast majority of women like the concept of the engagement ring very, very much. To most, it is a symbol of the culmination of a lifetime of waiting and searching for the right man, falling in love, starting a family, and generally "winning" at life.

Most women DO take a great deal of pride and satisfaction in this symbol. I think this is what a lot of the poker nerd/logic champions around here call utility. While you may not think this is good, or smart, or sensible, there is absolutely nothing wrong with a woman feeling this sense of pride and satisfaction over a material possession. I like showing off my new tv, or new car to my friends, and an engagement ring is no different for a woman (except for the fact that her possession symbolizes in her heart and mind something uniquely special to her).

Sure, if you were looking to propose to a woman and she rejected you based on the size of the ring, she'd be a bad person. You'd be lucky not to marry her. But seriously, this never, ever happens outside of television or the movies (or the bottom 1/1000th of 1% of human trash), and you're just falsely applying this concept to generalities.

Sure, you shouldn't overspend your means. You shouldn't need to sacrifice the necessities and quasi-necessities of life to buy her a piece of jewelery. This is obvious, and nobody is arguing that anyone should.

But for all you women-cynics in this thread who say things like, "I'd never marry a woman who wanted an expensive engagement ring" - a million lols. ALL women want nice things. So do you. They don't want a gaudy hundred thousand dollar ring, but it WILL make her happy to be able to show off her beautiful engagement ring with pride, and have other people tell her how nice it is. She will feel good, she will think about your commitment of a lifetime of devotion to one another every time she sees it, and this doesn't make her a gold digger. It makes her a regular person.

So I'd hope that you find enough "+EV utility" (gag) to want to make a woman that you're pledging a lifetime of devotion to feel good. I'd hope that you'd regard her feelings of happiness such that giving her a symbol of your love (even if you don't think it makes robosense for her to feel that way) is worth enough to you.

Maybe you found that one woman who thinks that there is no place for symbolism, that it cheapens your relationship to have a material symbol of your love. But I bet she has tons of pictures and other sentimental possessions that hold value to her. Perhaps she thinks that you want to hear her tell you these things. Many guys carp relentlessly about how "dumb" a tradition it is. Perhaps she's looking to appease. Or perhaps she just doesn't like wearing jewelery. But if this were the case, your woman would be in the vast, vast, vast minority, and her feeling that way would make her in no way superior to the other 99+% of the population that feels otherwise.

Get her a nice ring, if you truly care about making her feel good as she looks at that piece of rock and metal every day for the rest of her life. _WANT_ to spend more on something that she'll truly cherish than what you spend on your discretionary "toys". Don't overspend your means. Easy breezy.

Of course. Any girl I've had an exclusive relationship with I obviously respected them or I wouldn't have gotten into anything serious with them. I also have plenty of female friends who I respect. I'm pretty sure I respect more women than men. I just generally don't respect most people regardless of gender.

I'm curious as to what comments led to that belief?

it has nothing to do with thrift. paying for a diamond is an insult to my intelligence. if a woman came to me and said i had to spend 10k on a dog turd to win her love it wouldnt sound any stranger than spending 10k on a diamond. in fact a dog turd causes less strife in the world. THAT SAID, i did buy my wife a diamond because having it was integral to her sense of self worth because of the way she was brought up and the crowd she runs with. THAT SAID, if one is able to DO BETTER THAN ME, and talk their fiancee out of the ring that would be a HUGE WIN and not cheap or thrifty.

I was always on the whole "I hate diamond rings, think they're a waste" but then I bought a nice watch that I really like to wear and when I get a house I'm going to buy nice paintings to hang on the wall.

I'm sure my future wife will really enjoy having a nice ring, showing it off, etc. That doesn't make her a dumb ho any more than me having a nice watch instead of a casio makes me a mimbo.

Now, if I didn't have a lot of money and I saved up for a ring and the girl was disappointed that it wasn't bigger, I'd take my ring back and she'd be seeing the curb.

Although, if I'm going to have to respect the "tradition" of an expensive ring, I think her parents should respect the "tradition" of paying for a wedding.

Diamonds cause strife but using a private jet brings about puppies and rainbows. You can play the social conscious card or the baller card but not both.

Also as I said there are plenty of Canadian diamonds to be bought that cause zero strife for a small premium.

i said they cause more strife than a dog turd and i stand by that statement.

reading is FUNdamental

But you were using the "diamonds cause strife" as a social-consciousness type of a knock on them, and another reason why you are opposed to them. Thus, commentary on your lack of social consciousness in other areas is germane.

Reading comprehension is a FUNdamental skill developed in elementary school.

BTW - I feel bad for limon's wife. He clearly has zero respect for her.

i wish i was limon's wife.