Open Side Menu Go to the Top
Register
View Poll Results: 48÷2(9+3)=?
2
918 47.39%
288
1,019 52.61%

04-08-2011 , 01:10 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99
Again, substitute the / with ÷ on the calculator (if you could) and you will always get 288. The calculator is just misinterpreting your intentions. I agree this equation would be vague if OP had used a / instead of ÷. And maybe then this thread would be worth more than 5 posts. But he didn't, so this is just scary.
When you press the ÷ button on the calculator it shows up as /. At least on the TI 84+
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:11 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by suzzer99
Not if someone is interpreting it as a fraction bar instead of a divided by sign. A fraction bar implies everything after it (w/o a space) is in the denominator.

I could see Wolfram trying to be smart and interpret things as fractions, because 1/xy is usually going to mean 1/(xy) to the person who typed it and very rarely 1/y*x. The typer just forget to add the parenthesis.

Dear God I'm getting sucked in...
Wolfram disagrees with you here. 1/ab*2/cd interprets as (1/ab)*(2/cd), instead of the 1/(ab*(2/cd)) your post would imply.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:15 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ungoliant
This is so dumb. 1/2x == ½x. That just how you'd write it without the fancy special characters. Applying standard order of operations validates that equality. I can see calling it ambiguous. I would agree that in the interest of clarity it should be written as (1/2)x or 1/(2x). I'll even accept that smart people could make the mistake of assuming it's 1/(2x) and maybe it's even shown up in textbooks using that shorthand when the intent is obvious. But there's no way you can argue that it's definitively correct to interpret it that way in absence of any context. At best it's ambiguous and at worst you're just wrong.
If that were true, then there'd be loads of textbooks using the extraneous parentheses. No one has been able to cite one.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by private joker
We're arguing how an equation should be communicated, and whether or not there are certain rules to solve ambiguities with the nomenclature.
I thought this was covered?
Quote:
Originally Posted by zachvac
You do the parenthesies first, exponents, then the division and multiplication from left to right, then the addition and subtraction from left to right. Since there are no exponents or addition/subtraction it's just parenthesies first which gets translated to 48/2*12 then do the multiplication and division from left to right so you do 48/2 then multiply that result by 12. That gets you 288. This isn't grammar, it's math, you're supposed to learn this stuff in like 4th grade right?
As explained in the order of operations wiki
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:19 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GEToutHOEits5AM
People are debating on the bodybuilding.com forum about this and the votes are 50/50, I'm really hoping this forum is smart enough to all agree on one answer.

Link to thread : http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showth...hp?t=133389973

Grunch - 288.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:19 PM
Glad to see 288 pulling away with a 40 vote lead.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:22 PM
So sad, though, to see that the poll is even remotely close to 50-50.

WTF, people?!
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:26 PM
Lol at 288 people being so shocked at people answering 2...its pretty clear if you have ever taken high school algebra how you might get 2. I would bet on a group of 4th graders getting 288 more often then a group of college students who have taken calc+.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:32 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by af0808
Lol at 288 people being so shocked at people answering 2...its pretty clear if you have ever taken high school algebra how you might get 2. I would bet on a group of 4th graders getting 288 more often then a group of college students who have taken calc+.
I have higher hopes on 2p2. DUCY?
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:33 PM
AWESOME, AWESOME, AWESOME THREAD!!!!!!!!!!!!
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:35 PM
I should use 48÷2(9+3)=? as my facebook status
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by GMontag
If that were true, then there'd be loads of textbooks using the extraneous parentheses. No one has been able to cite one.
Sorry, I don't have any math textbooks laying around to support or contradict your anecdotal evidence. I guess that means I couldn't have ever passed algebra.

Most proper math books though would express fractions as fractions where the numerator and denominator are clearly unambiguous, not as an expression like this. If they did so in the context of a paragraph of text, that context would help clarify any ambiguity. This entire thread should make it obvious that any textbook that would present 1/2x completely out of any context and expect clarity isn't a very good one. Your claim that everyone who's passed algebra should assume 1/(2x) is ridiculous.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:37 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by TBadr
I thought this was covered?

As explained in the order of operations wiki
Right, but see that's just using one set of rules.

Other textbooks and manuals use this (quoted way earlier in the thread):



Rule 7.

So basically what is happening here is similar to different casinos having different rulebooks for poker. In Los Angeles (at Commerce, at least), forward motion is binding. In Vegas (at the Bellagio, at least), forward motion is not binding. Chips have to be released from hand for a bet to stand.

The 288 people are like Vegas pros declaring that there's some objective truth to forward motion not being binding. The 2 people are like Commerce pros declaring that there's some objective truth to forward motion being binding.

The rest of us (the ambiguity-defenders) are saying that different rules are in place. Which is why the equation itself is written too poorly for there to be a definite answer. If there were another set of brackets, then the ambiguity would be solved. Then you don't have to compare different sets of rules. All rules state that (48/2)x = 24x. And all rules state that 48/(2x)=24/x.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:40 PM
bout tree fiddy
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:44 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by private joker
Suzzer:

Nobody (at least nobody I recall) is arguing about basic math. i.e. everyone agrees that (48÷2)*(9+3) = 288. And everyone agrees that 48÷[2*(9+3)] = 2.

If we were arguing basic math, there would be disagreement over those figures. But there isn't.

We're arguing how an equation should be communicated, and whether or not there are certain rules to solve ambiguities with the nomenclature.
The equation was fine imo because of the ÷ sign. AFAIK there is zero ambiguity that 2(x+y) and 2*(x+y) are completely equivalent. So what is ambiguous about this? I agree that it could possibly be written so it's a little easier to read. But there is nothing that's mathematically ambiguous about it.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:46 PM
This equation is going to crash the internet
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:51 PM
For those answering 2:

48÷2(12) = ???
48÷2*12 =???

Also, I had to copy & paste the ÷ sign because I don't know how to make one.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:51 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ungoliant
Sorry, I don't have any math textbooks laying around to support or contradict your anecdotal evidence. I guess that means I couldn't have ever passed algebra.
Yep, that's pretty much exactly what it means. Not that that's anything to be ashamed of. I'm sure you do just fine in your janitorial work without having to know any of that fancy math with the letters.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:53 PM
None of this matters because the question is flawed.

Everyone knows 24 is the highest number
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:55 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by af0808
Lol at 288 people being so shocked at people answering 2...its pretty clear if you have ever taken high school algebra how you might get 2. I would bet on a group of 4th graders getting 288 more often then a group of college students who have taken calc+.
This. People who are really shocked and/or not understanding how anyone can get to 2 are $hit at math.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:57 PM
More than 500 posts arguing something that can literally be googled. *smh*

Quote
04-08-2011 , 01:58 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hume
More than 500 posts arguing something that can literally be googled. *smh
That is the essence of OOT.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 02:00 PM
i cant tell if im being leveled. math scares me.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 02:08 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by fredd-bird
That is the essence of OOT.
Quote
04-08-2011 , 02:11 PM
It's just a stupid question. You cant just mix notations any old how and expect people to follow it.

You start by using childish ÷ sign that never turns up in an equation/formula then halfway through you start using implied multiplication and brackets.

Either write is as 48÷2x(9+3) giving the 288 or 48/2(9+3) as all maths texts would do giving the answer as 2.
Quote

      
m