1.) What to do when you feel like its rigged?
Cash out, stop playing.
2.) What can i do to keep from losing my mind?
Cash out, stop playing.
3.) Any tips to deal with horrendous bad beats?
Cash out, stop playing.
4.) What can i do to get my confidence back and get over this?
Cash out, stop playing.

Time heals all wounds.

Ok, here. I answered the best I could.

1) Just remember it's not.

2) Take a break. Enjoy life. Sit down when your mind is clear again.

3) Same as the above. Take a break if you feel your mindset has changed in a negative way.

4) Again, same as the above. Forget about poker. Come back when you feel in a great mood and when you're feeling confident. Reading some helpful threads wouldn't hurt and watching poker videos can get you pumped up to play your A game.

*sigh*
he completely ignored every question i asked and decided instead to say how my bad beats are nothing compared to his and others and how my downswing is "nothing" blah blah blah....basically completely unhelpful and irrelevant to this thread and my questions.

why on earth people like him(and maybe u??) are in the beginners forum is beyond me....they don't want to help newer players out why post?
when did i ever say that pokerstars is targeting me or that the game is rigged?
what does the number of hands i've played have to do with the questions ive asked?

seriously.

I played a 25nl session yesterday where I lost 11 hands in a row with JJ+ that was ahead preflop and made it to showdown...including about 5 full stacks and only 2 of those did I get the money in bad. All I need to do to convince myself its not rigged is to look at my long term graph...the fact that OP can't do the same makes me seriously question he is a winning player. Are you being honest with yourself, OP?

1. Keep it real!

So easy to embelish stories and even start believing them yourself, AA vs KK 4 times in a row just doesn't happen and 300k hands at NL2-5 in 2 months suggests atleast 8-tabling for over 4 hours a day, again unlikely at these stakes. Your main concern is playing well so creating patterns in your mind that aren't there will only hurt your game.

2. Read this great post from Lego05:

Rake is capped ... usually rake is like 5% with a max of like $3. Say we're playing with $100 stacks at a .5/$1 table. Each player puts in $30 so a pot of $60. 5% of $60 is $3 so $3 is the rake but that's it ... rake is now maxxed out. Each player has $70 left but if each player puts that $70 in the pot no new rake is collected on that $140 ... still just $3 rake.

So pot stays at $60 site collects $3 rake and game continues and more rake is collected ....... players go all-in for last $70 dollars and site collects $3 rake and one player loses all money and game is over and no more rake is collected.

If you were the site which would you prefer?




As you can see for poker sites to maximize their profits they need players to have money and keep playing. For them to maximize profits they want lots of medium sized pots and lots of split pots and would most likely rather err from medium sized pots toward smaller pots rather than larger pots so players don't get wiped out and the games can keep going and they can keep collecting.

Yet for some reason nearly every single rigged theory has the idea that sites give setup hands or cause huge beats or something with the goal toward inflating the size of the pot. In reality making the pots bigger is not what the sites want to do ... it is near the opposite of what they want to do.


If I decided to rig a poker site to increase rake at that site I would rig it to create as many medium sized pots as I could (TPWK hands vs. TPGK or some second pairs) and I would err toward smaller pots ..... I would also rig for a lot of split pots as that is pure gold ..... the site collects all the rake and each player gets their money back (minus the rake of course) and they keep playing with basically the same amount they had before.


3. Remember there are numerous sites and 100k's of players tracking every hand pokerstars deals, any anomalies in the dealing would be picked up and crush their multi-billion dollar business, so pretty unlikely.


4. Every site is the same so either none are rigged or they are all rigged, making the former alot more credible. My 60 buyin swing last year was on pokerstars and my 60 buy-in swing this year was over AP, party, cake and fulltilt.


5. Unfortunately, It gets worse

Dropping 17 buy-ins sucks but it is nothing compared to what you will experience in the future as a day2day grinder. I've read that 6 month downswings are possible for winning players and have already experienced a couple of 60 buyin downswings in my 7 years of playing so far myself (higher stakes and aggresive play increase the variance alot). Remember this happens to EVERY grinder.

All these points bring me back down to earth. Good luck!

Well that's two or three buyins you could have saved assuming you are estimating accurately.
And yes you will have to defend your skill and competence. It's what makes it variance and not 'normal-ish'. We don't know if you suck or not but one weird thing about poker is that many more people think they play well than actually do. Especially while wondering if the game is fair or not.

You play 300k hands of poker you will see some strange swings. But surely you would have been way beyond $140 so did you cash out?

Your goals and expectations just got introduced to poker. I don't get why you're not happy that this hasn't happened to you before in 300k hands

Reorientation gogogogo

What to do when u feel like its rigged? Read the below thread.

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/32...-poker-871942/

Maybe you should, y'know, read the posts above yours.

And the number of hands you play is relevant because you may not be able to handle as many tables as you're currently playing. With less tables, you get to think about every decision more.

By the way, selective memory sucks. It's the reason you only remember your bad beats and not the good plays you've made. You say you've only lost 2 or 3 BI's due to tilt? That's kind of hard to believe. I'd imagine that number to be higher TBH.

Take a break... Start playing again when you know for a fact you're ready to play your best game.

Things to remember:
- Bad beats happen to everyone
- Downswings happen to everyone
- Poker is GAMBLING. If you are going to win everytime it wouldnt be gambling.


Best of luck -

Why would you title your thread "what to do when u feel like its rigged?" and then go on saying this thread isn't a poker is rigged thread?

The simple fact of the matter is you probably have an over-inflated sense of skill and think you are better than everyone else at poker (like most poker players), when in fact you are most likely quite bad. It's a simple fact that you have to come to terms with if you want to grow as a player.

Judging by your posts I would bet that you have lost way, way more than "2-3 buyins" from tilt.

lol advertising your **** thread? classic

The best advice I could you KAVILLA is to be honest with yourself. Why are you posting this? To prove something "Hey look guys see how I lose, I want sympathy, I want others to agree with me and tell me I did nothing wrong"

LDO you will take some bad beats and coolers, it happens to the best of players. I think you need more time for yourself to develop as a player, drop down and have fun at low limits or change games.

Absolutely. Read this thread for more advice on how to start meaningless threads that contribute nothing positive to the community.

Personal attacks aside,

the point of my posts is perspective. How exactly does your experiences compare to others?

The other point of my post is to try to slap my way through your ego.

The anger you are feeling stems from the fact that my posts are counter to your ego and on some level you realize that I'm right.

Ego is the absolute most dangerous thing in poker. I know it sounds like I have an ego, but when it comes to poker, I don't. I've gotten my arse kicked enough times to realize that i'm not as good as I think I am.

back to ego.

You may not realize it, but 1/2 of your problem is your ego-centric view about what is happening to you.

I'm trying to slap my way through your ego and give you two points

#1 you need the proper perspective on this and how your loses compare to those of other players
#2 you need to lose your ego-centric viewpoint

when i was a noob I made a few posts that were full of shtt. A few 2p2ers called me out, flamed me, and ripped me a new one.

At first I was mad, but the flame sessions were the best thing for me.

and unfortunately, sometimes the only way to get through someone's ego is with a good firm hard slap.

believe it or not, i'm trying to help you.

OP,

I had a similar experience a few weeks back at 10nl - I lost nearly 20 BI's from variance and tilt. It messed up my head too and I tried to explain that it wasn't the money, rather, all the hours grinding that makes it so hard to deal with.

I backed off from poker for a while and really cut back on the hours and tables and gradually built my confidence back up and adjusted my game and tried to up my poker knowledge.

Now I concentrate on not making mistakes rather than trying to win and on the hands where I do lose and I think 'what a fish - I can't believe he...' I stop myself and think 'hang on a minute - if I had better hand reading skills I could have reduced how much that cost me.. I'm the fish for paying off that river bet'.

Anyway, last week I passed the level of BR that I was at when I went on my downswing and it was a good feeling because I actually think the downswing helped me deal with tilt and totally changed my poker attitude.

I hope my 'newbs 1st experience of serious variance' tale helps you.

Good luck.

yes, thank you although i do have to say, that i am asking how to DEAL with bad beats and has little to do with the beats or hands themselves. as it stands now, if i start a fresh session after a good nights rest i come in with a positive attitude ready to play my A game. this morning is/was a great example...i come in i've managed to shrug off the fact that ive lost more than half my roll at the lowest of micros. first few minutes are fine i win and lose a few small pots took a minor "bad beat" when i lost to a better two pair on the river....still feeling good.
BOOM i look down at two tables i have KK and QQ. KK i am in late position and its folded to me; i make a signicant raise(4x BB) and get a quick 3 bet from the SB...BB folds...i repop him since hes not that deep and i figure he's got something like 88+ or AJ-AKs...he moves all in i call he flips over AA and it holds.

Ok right now im still calm but feeling a bit anxious and agitated as im starting to think about the last couple days where this exact scenario happened many times....hopefully this isnt going to be a repeat right.

on the other table i have QQ theres a few limpers in front of me i make a large raise and get reraised by one, others fold. i call flop comes low cards very dry...he has a little more than the size of the pot left behind him so i obviously shove this flop and he INSTA calls with 7 7....rivers a 7.

ok im thinking LUCKY ****ER so i rebuy and add a bit more since he's so bad....
two or three hands later on the same table i'm looking at KK. folded to me , i make a 3xBB raise and get repopped by the same guy from the hand above. i dont shove but raise him again and he goes all in im licking my chomps and insta call....he flips over A Q suited and flop comes K X Xs...turns a spade, rivers a spade he hits the runner runner flush for my whole stack which was close to 200BB since i bought in deep to exploit him.

so now i'm really pissed and to top it off on another table i run KK into AA AGAIN.....
at this point i am obviously raging....yelling at the computer and slamming stuff around. i feel like i should just get off, but the tables i'm at are SO bad i feel like i'm leaving money on the table if i dont buy back in.
i go on to lose another 6 buy ins in less than 30 minutes with only ONE of them being a legit non-cooler/bad play where i made a river all in call with the worst of a straight. hands i lost include AA into A 3 suited where he calls all in on flop overbet with a flush draw and hits on turn and QQ into KK twice...also hitting a set of 10s on the turn to be rivered by a gut shot nut straight. i then tilted off a buy in with AK on a dry flop i 3 bet his cbet and he shoved i called and he showed pocket 5s which hold up.

so now im getting derailed posting bad beats lol but i was typing them to show how the session went and what i was thinking as i started to lose. i understand that i made the correct decision and calls in most of these hands and thats all that should matter but how do you guys feel about me buying back in deep, not leaving, etc....
if i get flamed for posting any of these beats ill just remove them but i want you guys to see what is causing my pain and possible tilts.

Slap yourself and say "variance is a bitch!" Same thing, I guess. Reload and carry on, or if it messes your game up, sit out and take a break. Your confidence should never go down because of bad beats. Getting the money in ahead is all that counts in the end, as long as you do that, you should be happy.

The tricky thing about poker is that you have to just make correct decisions and not let the outcomes effect you. It's hard to do for pretty much everybody.

Also, FWIW, I agree with the others saying you're probably playing too many tables and it's taking you off your game.

Have you thought about changing your game schedule or the times you play? That sometimes helps me when I am on a DS. Just a few things to change the routine around that would make you +EV again.

Instead of playing 5NL/2NL try playing $1-$3 18 man SNGs They can still be profitable if you Multi Table them.

Instead of playing 5NL/2NL try playing PLO2 and start learning a new game. Yes the Variance is worse but it will help you get your mind thinking again. The problem with NLHE is that it becomes to robotic they way the play is in the lower levels. There is less skill and more variance you could say. By this I mean that you are more likely to be getting sucked on at those limits because the players are MUCH worse but the thing is that you don't have to learn how to outplay them you need to learn how to play with them.

I read what you wrote a few posts down about shoving 200bb's deep with AA and getting called with 69o and he hits a straight. Why don't you try playing poker instead of just shoving. You have to learn how to play AA as a 3 street hand. You raise it pre, you bet the flop, turn, river etc. Instead of just shove shove shove try to play the hand out and learn to fold when you are beat. I think that is your issue more than the Variance. You are having a tough time folding when you are beat.

Post HH's in Micro uNL forum it's better if we examine your play rather than just chalk it up as variance. I am not agreeing nor disagreeing that Variance has played a part but something tells me that HH's may prove this whole Variance thing to be untrue in this case.

"Since I bought in deep to exploit him"


Lol

"DONT SAY BOMB ON AN AIRPLANE!" (Don't say rigged in a poker forum)

i know its not rigged and you would see that if you actually took the time to read a post before responding...anyways,

i am a winning player at 2NL and was a winning player at 5NL until the massive run bad...

at 2nl i am 2.75BB/100 for full ring and was 6BB/100 for 6max close to 150k hands between the two of them.

does this really need to be explained? Do you not see the difference between "FEELS like its rigged" and saying its rigged?
im going to ignore where you basically imply that i suck at poker and dont realize it since i specifically asked for people not to come bring this junk into my thread....if i was such a good player, why would i be at 2NL and 5NL???
...does that make me a bad player? no, in fact as u can see above, i am a winning player at 2NL in spite of this. and to the others who keep asking about my small bankroll, yes ive cashed out $100 and lost the rest taking shots...

thanks but i must defend myself here by pointing out, once again, the questions i posed at the end of my original post....i am not looking for empathy or pity, i am looking for ways to improve my mental game and methods for dealing with dirty dirty beats and downswings. why is this so hard for you guys to understand/believe? and i cannot drop down any lower than 2NL as i already set my table limits after the run bad at 5NL.

dgiharris-
why you insist on posting in my thread if you have nothing to add...i dont care about my ego, i'm here to get help and to avoid taking the steps towards actually believing online poker is rigged....now please stay out of my thread, im asking politely.


thanks justin and otatop(potato).....while what you say seems so obvious, its alot harder to actually remember it when you're losing alot. i will try my best to focus on the decisions and not the outcomes...any tips on doing this? i wish i could somehow not see my cashier window or the money at the table...like a mod or something to make it look like play chips LOL.

and FWIW, i usually play 4-8 tables of 6max and i have little trouble dealing with the pace since i sometimes i roll out 10-14 tables when im playing quick and sharp.

Sometimes drugs can lessen the pain of bad beats and a common side effect is euphoria....it's win win.

Does being a winning player at 2NL even count as being a "winning player?"

Lol

tl;dr

If you can't handle downswings and the obvious tilt you have been on then I would suggest you take their advice and cashout.. either that or come find me on one of the sites and I will be more than happy to take that money off you