I've been playing on WPN, Seals & Aced..

I don't have a set bank roll.. I just deposit 50 here and there...

Sometimes I take that 50 & turn it into a few hundred bucks after a few days. Play .05/.10, .10, .25/.50.. and sometimes .50/1.. Sometimes I cash out. Other times I've went bust at 1/2. Other times I'm lucky to go up at all and just seem to crash & burn.

I know poker is a game of variance & I should have a set bankroll but I don't want to put a large chunk of cash in a site with where the state of online poker in the U.S is right now & people have issues with certain sites besides seals.. but the traffic is low and with bit coins.. Its like extreme micro stakes there..

Anyway simply question I guess but I'm fairly new to this and I hear a lot about hourly rate but I seem to either 1. Run real good and skyrocket up or 2. Buy in at 10 bucks and 3 hours later sitting at 16 bucks making 3 bucks an hour. Only playing one table.. at .05/.10 for an example.. Or go bust running a strong hand into the nuts. Should I be trying to make as much as I can when I'm running good & tighten up when I'm running bad even if that feels like hours, days, weeks???

I do find myself playing extremely to lose when I'm running bad. Desperately trying to turn suited connectors into the nuts & maybe when I seem to be running bad maybe I should tighten up? When I do that it seems like I'm not making anything or losing anything for hours.

And when I'm at a table that seems like everyone is playing extremely tight & after an hour sitting there with the same amount of buy in. Should I leave the table. Is there such a thing as a non profitable poker game so bad its not worth playing at all??..

Kind of a fat read.. Any advice or comments?? I kind of feel like an idiot with this being my first post

Ignore hourly. It's irrelevant for where you are. You might be jumping up levels too soon. Keep grinding low to build a far more substantial br. When you finally have enough to move up, remember that it's alright to drop back down if you're losing. Don't stay too high and lose the whole br. My rule of thumb is to not play at a level until I have 1000x the bb in my br. So, you said you play 1/2 sometimes. I would've only gone that high with at least a $2000 br. Br and buy-in is different. Buying in for 100 bb is fine but not if that's your whole br.

Cliffs: you're moving too high too fast. Grind out a healthier br and remember to drop back down if you start losing.

k, I understand that and I will make that change now. I think I'm going to study a little more & put off playing for a month. So far I've read Dan Harrington Tournament & Cash Game Books. Annie Dukes "decide to play great poker", Gordon's little green book and I should probably read them all again. Now waiting on Ed Millers Low Stakes Book from amazon =) Excited about that one!!

I guess my problem is if I feel like I'm not making any gains or worse losing. I feel like I'm just horrible which I'm sure I am!! I just don't understand it. I would think my gains would be a little more balanced throughout playing instead of being like an on or off switch.

Why don't you set aside a certain amount of money that will be your poker bankroll and deposit a chunk of it on a site. Then follow BRM, moving up or down in stakes according to your entire roll, not just the amount that you have online. Reload as needed and withdraw when you've earned more than you feel comfortable with leaving online.

Yes I should and I probably will because at this point I think I've just been playing to just kind of learn more and get better until I get to the point where I think I can be an overall winner at the micro stakes. If I deposited a chunk or even had a bank roll on the side and lost it all. I would be more disappointing losing it then just 40 here and 50 there. Even at the end of the same its probably the same.

Is there a place online I can find winning poker players graphs? So I can kind of see how variance looks like on paper?

I knew after I posted. I was going to get hammered about moving up in stakes with my whole bank roll.. lol =)

Just as an example of variance, here's my graph for May playing 10c/25c blinds:



(and FWIW, at Zoom at Stars at least, that's a significant winrate for the limit)

This should show enough why you shouldn't play with small BRs.

Nice graph. I found another thread with a ton of them. Some seem so steady upward with zero variance or maybe it just looks like it because its a few years span? I don't know.. Others just down constantly.. crazy someone can lose 20k or more without improving at all or quitting!!

What's the time span in that graph? Hours per week?

I wonder how good the players on U.S sites like WPN and Merge compare to players on pokerstars? I would think U.S sites would be a lot tougher because of the low player pool. Thoughts?

Nope, US sites are like some of the softest around. All the good players from the US either no longer player online or moved to play poker. Those who stopped playing won't be anywhere near as good as players now. In fact you regularly get people posting who beat 50nl+ pre bf and now can't even beat 10nl.

And I think it's about 70 hours worth of play because he two tables zoom (250 hands / table/hour) if depends on how many hands you play though obviously.

I don't really agree with this but if (and that's a big if) that's true, it's a matter of being rusty and not on your "A" game. It's not that the whole world is better than US poker players now. For example, Russia.

If the US legalized online poker today, they would again be dominating the virtual felt within a month.

The games have moved on so much. It's not a matter of opinion it's a fact. If you don't believe me go ask just about any mid/high stakes player in the world.

It's nothing to do with playing your A game. The games have moved on and are miles tougher. I'm not saying people wouldn't catch up but the effort required to do so would be immense.

Well, hopefully we'll find out who's right in due time.

I would just think there would be more percentage rise regulars on u.s sites and more recreational players on poker stars/full tilt making it an overall easier site to play on.

Okay.

Having played Merge and Stars, and seen HHs from other sites, my conclusions on US sites vs ROW sites are:

Merge was about as tough as Stars at 4NL, easier after that.
The regulated NJ sites are ridiculously soft.

**** hourly rate. Just throw $50-100 into an account and play .01/.02NL. That's at least 25 full buy-ins.

Edit: You can have fine BR management with just that amount.

Playing loose when running bad is nothing new, but you can change your preflop strategy to a better one by learning some standard opening ranges for beginners. The ranges should be pretty tight when you first start imo. As you study and improve you can add some more hands on the margins.

Yes there's such thing as a bad game. Does that mean you should quit? Well that depends entirely on you and your motivations for playing. I've stayed in bad games because I like the competition. I've left good games because of a poor atmosphere.

I cant stay focused on a game with so low of stakes. I limp in with a huge range of hands. Call bets I shouldn't & maybe I need to stay at that limit until I play like I should always.

Currently playing .05/.10 on aced. I think I need to get a solid bank roll for .10/.25. & drop down to .05/.10 if my bank roll goes to low. I've been doing pretty good at .05/.10 but still find my range opening up longer I play. I called a shove with top two pair. Didn't even think he had trips. (Flips over pocket deuces).

How's the skills differ from .05/.10, .10/.25 and .25/.50?? I've always at least thought I've played well at .25/.50 when I built my bank roll then not do so well at 1/2 online.

Why do you limp hands?

If you can't stay focused at 2NL you're likely never going to win at poker because you're a bit of a degenerate.

To see flops cheap I guess. Usual when I've grown to the largest stack at the table.Like yesterday for an example went from 10 to 30 bucks. Started opening my range. Trying to bust the smaller stakes.. Found myself back at my buy in after a while. Should've just kept playing the way that got me to the 30 dollar stack at a .05/.10 table..

You should move down to 2nl. It's pretty obvious to anyone that you have no idea what you are doing (limping, result-oriented, no relevant stats,...).

You shouldn't have to make more than one or two other 50$ deposits as this will be enough for 25BI at 2nl. Forget about any higher stakes, it's highly unlikely that you'd do well at anything over 10nl.

Then read the BQ stickies, post hands here and start (slowly) turning into a winning microstakes player.

Good luck.

For me it sounds like you are lacking the "Grinding mentality". Grinding mentality is where you play a lot of hands in the best possible way. From your text it sounds like you just want some fast and easy profits, so you move up in stakes.

It's all math. Whether you call sc's preflop, whether you chase the draw. It's all just math. Don't make -EV decisions just because you are losing.
Sure. Everyone likes to say that you should play vs regs and it's profitable. But in reality when we sit in a table with fish, we can make money so easily. Only when you start taking advantage of regular players leaks, that's when you start to make profit from them. Other than that it's mostly just coolers. Someone might make a bad bluff and you profit that way.
Deposit 50$, start playing at 2nl, use BRM and start winning! Hopefully you can withdraw before another ponzi scheme

Again mmss is a lil off base..

Everything he said there is pretty accurate. There are relatively few good online players left in the US.

Ran 50 bucks up to 230 on SealsWithClubs. 80 chips to 350 playing at .10/.20 6player max. In the last 4 days. Maybe about 12 hours of play.

I have another 150 bucks set aside in bit coin for my bank roll..

Trying to play serious, and will stop soon as I start playing to loose.

I end up running Kings into aces, Big slick into Kings, Someone hitting runner runner for a flush. And someone shoved with bottom pair and I had an over pair & he hit runner runner of for quads last night. Lost 3 buy ins.. then climbed back up to 350 last night