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poker roll and life roll ? poker roll and life roll ?

08-13-2012 , 10:05 AM
hi, maybe this isnt the best section at all to post this answer since im no more a begginer but.. here it is the problem...
i got a big roll, i play nl100 and nl200, i could easily play nl400, but i feel bad when i lose 1k in 1 day, i feel sooo bad when i lose 2k in a day, i've lost only 1 time over 3k in a day playin nl400, (only 8stack, so low number of bi but too much pain lol).
so i live with my family, im 19yo, they give me money for when in need, and im not such a ballas, when ive to buy big things i just cashout from the poker roll and gg... now ill start to pay from myself and gg, ive enough money and i earn more than my parents so its not correct what i do.

the question is: im moneyscared cause i dont have a life roll and i give too much credit at the money i could lose all day or the fact that i haven't no life roll has no pression about my poker roll?

how big should be my life roll, saying that im not balla and i live with my parents?
poker roll and life roll ? Quote
08-13-2012 , 10:08 AM
Bout tree fiddy
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08-13-2012 , 10:32 AM
Yes. What you are doing is wrong. If you are beating the games for more than your parents make and then lose it all and borrow some that is very wrong.

Anyways, nobody can answer that but you. If you are rolled for 400nl and 200nl but are afraid to play them cash out enough to be rolled for 100nl and put rest in life roll.

But since you have such a "big roll" you should be able to figure all of this out through experience.
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08-13-2012 , 10:41 AM
Yeah, pretty much what JEP said.

If you're comfortable playing $200nl, but no higher, set aside a bankroll for that game.

(Don't know how many buy-ins that should be. Maybe 50?)

$200 x 50 = $10 000.

Any left over is your life roll. Use it to buy stuff, save it for a rainy day, buy your Mom something nice (seriously) etc.

Good Luck.
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08-13-2012 , 10:53 AM
Yeah if poker is your only source of income 40-50 buyins at 200nl will be fine.

Everything else goes to the bank (Except whatever you spend to get something nice for your mom....seriously.)
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08-13-2012 , 12:21 PM
You may find this post I made recently about managing money helpful.


Quote:
Originally Posted by z4reio
No, never close to broke and looking for a stake, and I'll explain exactly why.

It's really not that difficult to handle your finances if you're disciplined and informed about it. There are ups and downs to the game, but your expected win rate is your actual income - the daily, weekly and monthly fluctuations mean nothing (assuming your game/conditions hasn't changed).

I run it like a business. I pay myself a wage - despite my results at the tables. I pay myself what my EV is in a game.

I'm not going to use my actual figures, but let's say you play $1/$2 NL and your established win rate is 6bb/100. This means that you earn $12 every 100 hands, or $12 / 100 = $0.12 per hand.

Your EV in the game is $0.12 per hand. If you played a 1247 hand session, then you earned, in EV, $149.64. It doesn't matter if you won $1500 or lost $1500 - those are deviations from the mean and have little to do with anything and nothing to do with your actual worth at the table.

This is why winning professional players go broke. They spend lavishly during upswings and come up short on downswings because they never actually determined how much they truly are earning (long-term) at the tables and compensate themselves accordingly.

So what you do is decide what percentage of total expected profits (EV) will go toward business capital (depends on a few variables). Say you want to cut 20% to the business and keep 80% of your EV (wage).

Now that 12 cents per hand is 9.6 cents per hand; the other 2.4 cents go toward expanding the business (i.e., larger capital = better investment opportunities).

Let's say you played 8274 hands in a week:

8274 * $0.096 = $794.30 to you for your time at the tables
8274 * $0.024 = $198.58 to the business for financing your play (even though it is you staking yourself)

Of course that $198 is not being taken out of the bank account that houses your roll, so you just take your earnings for the week, $794, and let the rest build up in your "corporate" account.

Here's the thing. When I went 5 months without making any money at the tables, I was still paying myself my wage - my EV based on my hours (or hands for online) at the table.

Health insurance premiums, IRA or individual 401k etc., disbursements must still be paid out - just like it is at any other corporation that's suffering a downtrend; you must pay your workers for their time. Fortunately, you, as a responsible business owner, didn't overspend when times were good and can afford to keep greasing the wheels when times are tough.

As you can see, if you paid your business 20% of your profits (in EV only) and never pay yourself above your EV, then you can weather the swings when the time comes and continually expand the business, as well.
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08-13-2012 , 01:00 PM
I am not really inclined to give financial advice but having read some here that I disagree with I just want to make one point.

Your life roll is serious business, unless you are a poker professional your poker roll should not be.

As a hobbyist, I have written off the funds I have on line and in an envelope for poker. If I lost it or lost a lot of it, I would only replace it from discretionary funds when it was comfortable for me to do so. I consider poker entertainment. Fortunately it has been entertainment that doesnt cost me money. If it starts costing me money I will have to re-evaluate it.

Poker is a fascinating game for many of us. It appeals to our competitve nature and offers both strategy and luck opportunities. I believe it is also a trap for many people and I hope you will not become one of those people.

It is simply true that in order to make money in the long term you have to out think and out play other players by more than the game operator takes from your pot-by-pot winnings. That can be both a siren song and a trap, not to mention the fact that the other players have similar motivation and equal access to information.
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08-13-2012 , 01:28 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bona
Your life roll is serious business, unless you are a poker professional your poker roll should not be.
Yes, absolutely. I should clarify that my post was directed towards professional players only. I figured if he makes more than his folks but borrows from them when times are tough, then he's lacking serious money management principles. Hobbyists should never put poker finances above anything.
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08-13-2012 , 01:43 PM
nice post z4reio, ty everybody...

some details, im a student but i play over 150k hands/month at decent level so i make decent money/month, it's not my profession but i would like if it is...
i play at leas 200x for level. (ok, i dont have already 80k for play safetly) so i can deal with big downswings but at the level of mindset is very hard...

so how much money should i have for my life roll? 20% of my expected monthly earnings?


sorry for bad english.
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08-13-2012 , 01:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by !llusioNz
nice post z4reio, ty everybody...

some details, im a student but i play over 150k hands/month at decent level so i make decent money/month, it's not my profession but i would like if it is...
i play at leas 200x for level. (ok, i dont have already 80k for play safetly) so i can deal with big downswings but at the level of mindset is very hard...

so how much money should i have for my life roll? 20% of my expected monthly earnings?


sorry for bad english.
I your shoes I would look ahead to the stages and passages of life, higher ed, marriage, kids, college funds, retirement etc and set some personal goals for savings and income. It is unlikely your very long (more than 3-5 years) term is accurately predictable but at least make a 3 year plan with an eye on future needs. Then review and re-evaluate your plan every month to stay on track and every year to extend the plan out further.

If your situation is anything like I infer from your posts, you may be playing poker for way more money than makes sense and really flirting with problem gambling in the long run. All your decision of course but I hope you don't go there.
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08-13-2012 , 02:56 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by z4reio
You may find this post I made recently about managing money helpful.
Sick post.
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