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JJ vs QQ JJ vs QQ

09-17-2015 , 04:52 PM
This is the hand that played out,

    Poker Stars, $0.01/$0.02 No Limit Hold'em Cash, 5 Players
    Poker Tools Powered By Holdem Manager - The Ultimate Poker Software Suite. View Hand #37119620

    MP: $1.16 (58 bb)
    CO: $2.15 (107.5 bb)
    Hero (BTN): $1.70 (85 bb)
    SB: $2.08 (104 bb)
    BB: $1.75 (87.5 bb)

    Preflop: Hero is BTN with Q Q
    MP raises to $0.06, CO folds, Hero raises to $0.14, SB folds, BB calls $0.12, MP raises to $0.22, Hero calls $0.08, BB raises to $0.30, MP calls $0.08, Hero calls $0.08

    Flop: ($0.91) 3 J 2 (3 players)
    BB bets $0.42, MP folds, Hero raises to $1.40 and is all-in, BB calls $0.98

    Turn: ($3.71) 4 (2 players, 1 is all-in)
    River: ($3.71) 6 (2 players, 1 is all-in)

    Spoiler:
    Results: $3.71 pot ($0.13 rake)
    Final Board: 3 J 2 4 6
    MP mucked and lost (-$0.30 net)
    Hero showed Q Q and lost (-$1.70 net)
    BB showed J J and won $3.58 ($1.88 net)



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    I was the Hero, i just dont know whether i played well, badly, what i could have done differently to stop me losing the hand? Any comments are helpful.

    Thanks.

    BludGnome
    JJ vs QQ Quote
    09-17-2015 , 05:45 PM
    wow that preflop is a cluster****, raise a lot bigger the first time around and then maybe you don't get the ridiculous situation where you have MP clicking it back and then BB backraise clicking it back at you. it's just daft that there's a 5b and it only reaches 15bb pre. i really don't know readless (which i assume you are, as you've given none) whether to blast it all in or call to setmine. i'd likely 6b jam pre as MP's only short

    flop's an irrelevance, what are you putting him on that you think shoving's good?
    JJ vs QQ Quote
    09-17-2015 , 05:49 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by sixfour
    wow that preflop is a cluster****, raise a lot bigger the first time around and then maybe you don't get the ridiculous situation where you have MP clicking it back and then BB backraise clicking it back at you. it's just daft that there's a 5b and it only reaches 15bb pre. i really don't know readless (which i assume you are, as you've given none) whether to blast it all in or call to setmine. i'd likely 6b jam pre as MP's only short

    flop's an irrelevance, what are you putting him on that you think shoving's good?
    I didnt put him on Jacks, i was unsure of the read because of the way the bets seem to play out, when he bet i placed him on AJ, the pots big and on that flop with AJ you're winning a lot of the time, so i thought i had the over pair to his Jack that made me think shoving was good.
    JJ vs QQ Quote
    09-17-2015 , 06:00 PM
    1st off, I'll directly answer the question of what you could have done to stop from losing the hand. You could have folded preflop, but you would have lost the hand. Once the flop came, it doesn't matter what you do, you were going to lose the hand. On the flop the pot is .91 and you have $1.48 left, and you have an overpair. You should NEVER fold in that situation. If it turns out, as it did, that you are behind, don't worry about it. Most of the time you will win.

    Now: to what you should have done.

    What you probably should have done is raised more preflop. He makes it .06, make it .20. In some worlds (probably not this one) JJ might fold. You don't expect them to, and you don't want them to. Most likely BB calls, MP raises to .34 or shoves. Note that he only has $1.16 to start. If he raises to .34, you should shove. The effective stacks are not that big, and if you and BB call, you will be pot - committed on the flop if there is no ace or king. (the pot will be about $1 - and you will have less than that left).

    It is very unlikely BB has AA or KK, though it is possible. If he does, and decided not to 4-bet on the first go-round, so be it. At this point you really don't care what your opponents do. The greatest likelihood is that they will both call you with worse hands, and there is a chance MP has AA or KK - but he has a short stack, and there really isn't much you can do about it. If they do call with worse hands you win - maybe not the money, but you did the right thing and got it in with the best hand. Not much more you can do than that.

    At higher stakes, a competent BB might decide to throw away JJ here, especially if you have a very tight image - and then you will probably win. But at these stakes he is probably calling - and when he hits the set you lose. It is pretty clear that the button didn't have AA or KK - because there is no chance in hell that he would have folded on the flop for .42 if he had one of those hands.
    JJ vs QQ Quote
    09-17-2015 , 06:20 PM
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by VBAces
    1st off, I'll directly answer the question of what you could have done to stop from losing the hand. You could have folded preflop, but you would have lost the hand. Once the flop came, it doesn't matter what you do, you were going to lose the hand. On the flop the pot is .91 and you have $1.48 left, and you have an overpair. You should NEVER fold in that situation. If it turns out, as it did, that you are behind, don't worry about it. Most of the time you will win.

    Now: to what you should have done.

    What you probably should have done is raised more preflop. He makes it .06, make it .20. In some worlds (probably not this one) JJ might fold. You don't expect them to, and you don't want them to. Most likely BB calls, MP raises to .34 or shoves. Note that he only has $1.16 to start. If he raises to .34, you should shove. The effective stacks are not that big, and if you and BB call, you will be pot - committed on the flop if there is no ace or king. (the pot will be about $1 - and you will have less than that left).

    It is very unlikely BB has AA or KK, though it is possible. If he does, and decided not to 4-bet on the first go-round, so be it. At this point you really don't care what your opponents do. The greatest likelihood is that they will both call you with worse hands, and there is a chance MP has AA or KK - but he has a short stack, and there really isn't much you can do about it. If they do call with worse hands you win - maybe not the money, but you did the right thing and got it in with the best hand. Not much more you can do than that.

    At higher stakes, a competent BB might decide to throw away JJ here, especially if you have a very tight image - and then you will probably win. But at these stakes he is probably calling - and when he hits the set you lose. It is pretty clear that the button didn't have AA or KK - because there is no chance in hell that he would have folded on the flop for .42 if he had one of those hands.
    Thank you. This actually helped me quite a lot to understand how i should/shouldnt have played
    JJ vs QQ Quote
    09-17-2015 , 09:05 PM
    Yeah the first problem was your 3 bet sizing was too small.
    JJ vs QQ Quote

          
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