JJ facing 4bet preflop - Beginning Poker Questions

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JJ facing 4bet preflop

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07-29-2008 , 09:24 PM

ledzepx

enthusiast

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 59

Poker Stars $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 5 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

callng _mach (BB): $7.75
jesus ricard (UTG): $18.80
Judas_12 (CO): $10.25
Hero (BTN): $19.20
Faky7 (SB): $4.00

Pre Flop: Hero is BTN with J

jesus ricard raises to $0.30, 1 fold, Hero raises to $1, 2 folds, jesus ricard raises to $3, Hero???

Villian's 27.5/20/5 over ~40 hands, no particular reads though
I've been playing pretty tight
Thoughts?

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07-29-2008 , 09:36 PM

ilovethisgame

banned

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 311

i call and react on the flop.

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07-29-2008 , 09:43 PM

Zen`xL

newbie

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 33

I think I'd throw the Jacks away here... Facing an initial raise, and then a re-raise, calling here might be a mistake.

Your going to see an A,K, or Q on the flop about what, 40% of the time? If any of these hit and you face a pot size raise, you may feel obligated to call.

This is unless you've seen him dump in chips with a few odd hands.

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07-29-2008 , 10:06 PM

rockalum84

banned

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 52

you are playing .05/.10 NL. i don't think i'd fold JJ here.

i was playing .10/.25 at bodog last night. got 99 UTG (6-max). superaggresive player next to act raises the pot. button reraises to like $3.25. i think and decide to call. 3-way pot.

Flop Q 9 8.

I bet. Superaggro guy goes allin. So does the button. I instacall. I'm up against KJ and AQ.

Thanks for the pot.

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07-29-2008 , 10:24 PM

Autist18

veteran

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 2,837

Easy fold, people at NL10 wont 4bet with anything less than QQ.
And you can't setmine here profitably anymore.

Yes, fold.

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07-30-2008 , 01:02 AM

WorldsUnluckiest

journeyman

Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 310

autist is 100% right
fold is your best move

you can call to setmine but it's not worth it. certainly do not raise. there is not a chance that you have the better hand.

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07-30-2008 , 01:21 AM

allyasia

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,025

the question is
are you willing to go allin on a safe flop?
if not, flop preflop.
calling 3bet to setmine is not profitable
to do that, you need to be able to win some postflop without hitting that J

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07-30-2008 , 01:23 AM

allyasia

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,025

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockalum84

1. you got lucky hitting that set
2. to set mine, if you are not getting 12x return investment, you are losing money in the long run if you keep that up.

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07-30-2008 , 04:29 AM

rockalum84

banned

Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 52

Quote:

Originally Posted by allyasia

1. you got lucky hitting that set
2. to set mine, if you are not getting 12x return investment, you are losing money in the long run if you keep that up.

1) So I got lucky holding the best hand AND having it improve against two donkeys?

2) i more than got 12x on my investment, so clearly it was worthwhile.

You assume i was setmining. I also knew I had the best hand and would have won with all low cards on the flop. So i'm not just setmining.

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07-30-2008 , 12:03 PM

#10

allyasia

veteran

Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,025

Quote:

Originally Posted by rockalum84

somehow i misread it
i though it was 10NL hand.
but it's 25NL
^^

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07-30-2008 , 07:10 PM

#11

JulioYalil

banned

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,209

Quote:

Originally Posted by Autist18

Easy fold, people at NL10 wont 4bet with anything less than QQ.
And you can't setmine here profitably anymore.

Yes, fold.

this 90% of the time

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07-30-2008 , 08:11 PM

#12

ledzepx

enthusiast

Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 59

Just a follow up question, if I'm in this spot (say against a looser villian) and plan on getting it in on a low flop, then is a shove better preflop, as there's no value setmining, and I may gain a bit of fold equity?

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07-30-2008 , 08:49 PM

#13

TexArcher

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 5,813

Quote:

Originally Posted by ledzepx

You mean against one loose villain? Then absolutely.

In this case, with all that raising in front of you, your jacks are dominated almost every time. This hand worked out well, but it's going to lose a lot of money over the long haul.

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07-31-2008 , 02:35 AM

#14

raze

Pooh-Bah

Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 5,540

I think you can set-mine here, especially if his range really is QQ+ and he's not folding post-flop. Call $2 to hit a set 1-in-8, win at least an $18 pot on average when you hit a set and its profitable. He's got like $16 behind.

edit: you could be ahead PF, but it will be very tough to play when we flop an overpair.

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07-31-2008 , 06:20 AM

#15

ilovethisgame

banned

Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 311

i really want to sit down at tables with those of you who will fold JJ preflop.

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07-31-2008 , 09:45 AM

#16

breathweapon

old hand

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 1,198

Quote:

Originally Posted by ilovethisgame

i really want to sit down at tables with those of you who will fold JJ preflop.

JJ is not a good hand, because it's got 0 chance to be ahead of their 4bet range, sans LAGs or blinds vs button.

You will be thoroughly raped if you can't lay down JJ to 4bets.

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07-31-2008 , 01:27 PM

#17

LysSta

banned

Join Date: Nov 2007 Posts: 977

u coin flip at best

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07-31-2008 , 01:47 PM

#18

pokerloser10056

grinder

Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 594

Quote:

Originally Posted by breathweapon

JJ is not a good hand, because it's got 0 chance to be ahead of their 4bet range, sans LAGs or blinds vs button.

You will be thoroughly raped if you can't lay down JJ to 4bets.

yeah i have been raped a few times.....just fold.

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