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I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct?

10-07-2008 , 10:23 AM
Not cbetting missed flops is total uNL spew, start doing the exact opposite and cbetting 100% of your flops with exceptions here and there if they aren't total pay phones.

-8BI sucks, but it happens, so either grind it out or take a break.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 11:50 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by breathweapon
Not cbetting missed flops is total uNL spew, start doing the exact opposite and cbetting 100% of your flops with exceptions here and there if they aren't total pay phones.

-8BI sucks, but it happens, so either grind it out or take a break.
My experience with c-bets at these stakes is that I get called 75-80% of the time and then have to give up. I analyzed this as a good way to leak chips. What do you think I should do here? I stopped/selectively c-bet and it seems to work for me.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 12:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoCountry4OldDonks
My experience with c-bets at these stakes is that I get called 75-80% of the time and then have to give up. I analyzed this as a good way to leak chips. What do you think I should do here? I stopped/selectively c-bet and it seems to work for me.
I'm finding this as well, I have stopped c-betting as much, and added in fold/call c-bet %age to my HUD, saves me some money, and is increasing my BB/hr, now if i can just learn to fold when I know I'm beat, then I'll really stop spewing chips away.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 02:25 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Windowslm
I'm finding this as well, I have stopped c-betting as much, and added in fold/call c-bet %age to my HUD, saves me some money, and is increasing my BB/hr, now if i can just learn to fold when I know I'm beat, then I'll really stop spewing chips away.
very true! I usually cbet 75% of the time and i actually lose more money from cbetting than not cbetting because it typically sets up a trap. However, I have won some very large pots from cbetting the flop and hitting a pair on the turn/river.
another good point you made was learning how to fold when you are beat. Sometimes i call it just to see what the actually had and how he played it because i usually see the person again and use that information against them.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 02:59 PM
You arent thinking about your opponent enough and what they are doing. The guys 88 example is perfect with them thinking he raised so he probuly missed the flop. These micro players look at the board texture and are like theres no way he could have caught that and push/float, etc.

Basically if you are fit or fold, its easy to play you. You have to pick your spots on "bluffing" per say with cbets. Fit or fold is still the same with cbets as well, if you cbet 100% and check the turn everytime you miss than you are back to the same boat and most players will pick up on this.

5nl is really easy to beat especially with 200bb stacks, 10nl is 100bbs. You are losing because you are leaving dead money on the table everytime you miss and if you so happen to stack someone the payoff isnt as much. Also more players at your table are picking up on these big leaks so they can steal pots away or get away from hands if you bet.

Go back to 5nl and retool your game at a cheaper price. You need to assign hand ranges and pick up on tendacies with how people are playing their cards.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 03:16 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by NoCountry4OldDonks
My experience with c-bets at these stakes is that I get called 75-80% of the time and then have to give up. I analyzed this as a good way to leak chips. What do you think I should do here? I stopped/selectively c-bet and it seems to work for me.
I guess you just tighten up and bet for value/check behind then, it's going to be ABC poker with you avoiding every draw on the board for awhile, 10NL sucks like that.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 04:14 PM
@OP

Down 8 buyins now, don't feel bad, heres a recent one to add to the collection of flush v.s flush, set v.s set, KK v.s AA all in pre-flop and all around bad beats

Full Tilt Poker $0.05/$0.10 No Limit Hold'em - 6 players
The Official 2+2 Hand Converter Powered By DeucesCracked.com

SB: $18.65
Hero (BB): $10.85
UTG: $15.40
MP: $11.25
CO: $4.70
BTN: $10.00

Pre Flop: ($0.15) Hero is BB with 7 7
2 folds, CO calls $0.10, BTN raises to $0.45, 1 fold, Hero calls $0.35, 1 fold

Flop: ($1.05) 3 5 7 (2 players)
Hero bets $0.80, BTN calls $0.80

Turn: ($2.65) 2 (2 players)
Hero bets $2.20, BTN calls $2.20

River: ($7.05) J (2 players)
Hero bets $7.40 all in, BTN calls $6.55 all in

Final Pot: $20.15
Hero shows 7 7 (three of a kind, Sevens)
BTN shows J J (three of a kind, Jacks)
BTN wins $18.15
(Rake: $2.00)
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 04:30 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Void06
Well KT entered my mind but its supposed to be a weaker hand or so I've been told. The fact that he raised in mp made me think it was a stronger hand like AK AQ or AJ. I thought it was a pair and maybe a straight or flush draw. I am ahead of all those hands and only behind KT and JJ AA QQ. I dont think he'd be giving a free card with a set on a board that coardinated so I really thought I was way ahead. I suppose I should have just called and re-evaled the river.
Sometimes at these stakes I've tried to use this logical thought process, but soon learned A LOT of the other 10NL players don't think about their position and such. Just today I raised KK from button and SB called my 4xbb raise with J7o then on the flop it was 779 so naturally I thought he missed it and I bet hard on flop and turn, and ended with my stack in and a loss of $10.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 05:36 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by skip8118
You arent thinking about your opponent enough and what they are doing. The guys 88 example is perfect with them thinking he raised so he probuly missed the flop. These micro players look at the board texture and are like theres no way he could have caught that and push/float, etc.

Basically if you are fit or fold, its easy to play you. You have to pick your spots on "bluffing" per say with cbets. Fit or fold is still the same with cbets as well, if you cbet 100% and check the turn everytime you miss than you are back to the same boat and most players will pick up on this.

5nl is really easy to beat especially with 200bb stacks, 10nl is 100bbs. You are losing because you are leaving dead money on the table everytime you miss and if you so happen to stack someone the payoff isnt as much. Also more players at your table are picking up on these big leaks so they can steal pots away or get away from hands if you bet.

Go back to 5nl and retool your game at a cheaper price. You need to assign hand ranges and pick up on tendacies with how people are playing their cards.
I never thought of things this way, looking back it is a pretty easy read...I am definately going to have to switch up my game, thanks for this great insight.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 06:18 PM
I play very much like you and it does feel like people are exploiting me at times. Once I noticed that it was the same guy 3betting me or calling my 3bets with overcards just because he knew that I would shut down to his aggression on later streets. I dealt with him though using a check raise bluff.
I find that check raising when im forced to play OOP can be far more effective than Cbetting. Maybe give it a try yourself.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 09:42 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peanut Juice
I play very much like you and it does feel like people are exploiting me at times. Once I noticed that it was the same guy 3betting me or calling my 3bets with overcards just because he knew that I would shut down to his aggression on later streets. I dealt with him though using a check raise bluff.
I find that check raising when im forced to play OOP can be far more effective than Cbetting. Maybe give it a try yourself.
Imo its not a bad play but what are you going to do with AA on a 10 8 2 board you will bet the flop and he will call. Then check raise his turn steal. By you check raising the flop, he could play cautiously and bet .50 or even 2 bucks out where its easy to see you have a monster and want to play for stacks when you check raise.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote
10-07-2008 , 11:47 PM
Get pokertracker, books, a video account, and a coach...destroy 5NL, 10NL, and then never look back.
I can beat 5nl but I can't beat 10nl. Do I find a Coach or man up and get a vid acct? Quote

      
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