Hi guys,

I have tried opening up my ranges by alot and I recently encountered this particular situation where I do not have a made hand but I calculate that my equity is "big" so I reraised V all in with what little I have.



1/1 Home Games

HERO(IP) : 56hh


V limps in MP
MP2 limps
Hero raises to 12$

Both limpers calls 12$


POT :40~$

FLOP : Ah4h9d

All checks to hero
Hero cbets 30$
MP2 Folds

MP check/raises to 75$

Hero tanks for a moment to calculate the outs
Hero has backdoor straight and FLUSH draws totalling of 15OUTS for TURN and I thought, hmm approximately 60% and I reraise shove an additional of 90$ after calling the 45$ check/raise from V.

Can I calculate the backdoor straight too if I am shoving all in?

Since V minraised, the odds are too good to give away, and I know V thinks that I have AK because thats my range previously. V didnt think I would open with stuff like 56hh ever.

If I were to call here, I might as well shove V in the face cos although I might be behind but V is likely trying to use aggression against hero so thus the shove.

Please advise, Thanks!

most times just give you hand a boost of about 4% for each back door draw and you will be close enough.

but when you figure your outs you also have to take in the chance your opponent also has your draw but a better one and you are almost dead.

the reason you shove in these spots is to not give opponents a read on you for other times when you shove with a made hand. and to pick up the pot now if he makes a mistake and folds.

i missed part of what you were saying as you are not a 60% chance of making that hand.

an out means a card that turns you from losing hand to winning hand, as i see it anyway. If you hit a card that THEN gives you outs for the river is nice but certainly you canNOT count each of those cards as a full out.

i still dont see how you got to 15 outs.

What exactly is your read. on the on hand you are saying that Villain thinks you have AK. Then you say that Villain is using aggro to push Hero off. But if he thinks Hero has AK then pushing him off is unlikely, no? so he prolly has AK beat with Ax atleast where he hit 2 pair

P.s: complete Hand History would be better. How many players, tendencies (off the involved players) and starting stacks

Backdoor outs add about 1.5% equity to your hand if you're stacking off against top pair, but it really depends on what villain actually has.

In this hand, you just have a naked flush draw and some runner-runner straight possibilities. Going runner-runner to make a straight is pretty unlikely.
Just take the cheap pot odds and call. When you jam, you usually need some fold equity to make it a breakeven play (i.e. when you get called in this spot you have much less than 50% equity, so have to suck out. To make up for the hand equity deficit, you need some fold equity).

Against top pair, you have 9 outs to a flush, and 9 other cards that can give you a straight draw (3s, 7s, 8s - the latter only gives you a gutshot). Picking up 6 or 3 more outs is not the same as making the hand.
Against AKo, you have about 38% equity, which is only a little more than a basic flush draw would have. Since villain could have a set, two pairs, or pair+a blocker, you've probably got closer to 34% equity vs villain's stack-off range, so you're basically burning money if he's never bluffing.

You don't have 15 outs; as someone else stated, you can't count the backdoor outs as full outs because they don't give you a winning hand, they only give you additional outs for the river. Also, I assume you're using the rule of 4 and 2 to arrive at 60%. That rule is an approximation, and it gets less and less accurate the more outs you have. You'de actually be around 55% with 15 outs, and that's assuming the villain just has top pair. You'd be 50-50 against 2 pair and 40% against a set.

As others have posted you don't know what outs are and how to count them, which is pretty much day one in poker school (maybe day two after learning the rules). You also recently made another thread about hand rankings, which is also pretty basic.

So I'm going to gently suggest you might want to see the following as a bit of stretch (also from a recent thread of yours)

It kinda sounds like because you've discovered 2+2, you think you are now better than your poker peers. That's not how it works and you really need to get your head in a good poker primer without delay if you are intent on taking the game seriously.

Trying to piece the game together with random posts on 2+2, won't work in isolation.

Hi Fatboy54!

Thank you for your kind inputs!

Greatly appreciated.

Hi guys!

Thanks for your wonderful advice!

Yeah, I use the 4 and 2 rule for calculation.

I have done some reflection on this hand a couple of days ago and I thought that, if I were to make the call, Im getting 2:1 to call, but If i were to call, and since my stack is short to begin with, Im literally all in OTT with 90~$ behind, and if V were to put me all in, I am going to have to call too, since its still 2:1 OTT.

So is it alright if I were to use the 2:1 OTT as well?

Thanks once again for your advise!

Wait and see what the turn card is and also see whether villain shoves. If you have enough equity to call, you call. If you don't, you fold. Easy game.