Winamax No-Limit Hold'em Tournament, 150/300 Blinds (4 handed) - Winamax Converter Tool from http://poker-tools.flopturnriver.com/Hand-Converter.php

SB (t34,431)
BB (t29,625)
UTG (t40,219)
Hero (Button) (t13,450)

Hero's M: 29.89

Preflop: Hero is Button with A, 8
1 fold, Hero raises t600, SB raises t1,500, 1 fold, Hero calls t1,050

Flop: (t3,600) 2, Q, 4 (2 players)
SB bets t1,950, Hero calls t1,950

Turn: (t7,500) A (2 players)
SB bets t30,806, Hero calls t9,825

River: (t27,150) J (2 players)

Total pot: t27,150

Results below: [spoiler]
Hero had A, 8 (one pair, Aces).
SB had A, 10 (one pair, Aces).
Outcome: SB won t27,250[/spoiler]


we are in 4 max format and I a play against an aggresif player
I open he 3b and i call I thinck this is right
on the flop I know he cbet 100% of the time on 4 hand so I dicide to call But I not sure ; should I C/R on this ?
the important point for me is on the turn he dicide to lead all in overpot I don't knows exactly he's range but considering the draw possibilty I dicide to call this

I'd like somme of u to help me on this hand

GL on tables

Fold pre, fold flop, fold turn assuming he's just aggressive and not spewy. 100% cbet over 4 hands isn't abnormal, and this isn't a very good hand to float with (or raise with).

I'm not familiar with Winamax 4-max tournaments. I presume only one player gets paid.

I don't have a big problem with you opening the hand with a garbage A on the BTN but when your opponents have > 100bb, you need more than a min-raise. Call the 3-bet only if you will play back or fold on further streets. Calling the flop is weak. Fold or 3-bet bluff.

Why would villain risk 1/3 of his stack and falling from second to fourth if he was scared of the A? Fold turn.

I don't play tournaments but it seems these 4-max tourney are all satellites where top 2 get the ticket.

nop it's like a standard tournament where the top 10% get payed

I still don't think we understand. In a 6-max SnG STT, 2 get paid, so top 33% are paid, not top 10%. In a 9 or 10 man Sng STT, 3 get paid, so either 33% again or 30%. Pay one on a 4-mx SnG woud be pay to 25% not top 10%.

Are you actually saying that 4-max is an MTT of an indefinte number of of 4-man tables, and the top 10% of entrants gets paid?

If so, to choose the relevant approach to the hand, we need to know things like how many players remain, how many will be paid, and the average stack.

Since this is a 4 handed table, raising from the BTN with Ax is fine. Calling the 3-bet pre since you are in position "can" be fine if you have a solid read on villain and his post flop tendencies.

Assuming V is very fit-n-fold post flop, I can get behind calling his 3-bet. My plan would be to call the c-bet and then re-evaluate on turn. If V has air he should give a sizing tell on turn and if he portrays weakness we take the pot away from him and if he continues to show strength we fold.

So calling the flop with this plan is fine, but the turn

Yuck. A8 4 handed and an Ace hits and V shoves into us is just gross. I think V is polarized here, either he has an Ace or he is bluffing with something like KJ trying to rep an Ace.

If he has an Ace, the question is, how does his Ax fair against ours?

We beat A3, A5, A6, A7
We lose to A2, A4, A9, AT, AJ, AQ, AK
we tie with A8

this is right on the line between calling and folding...

The other aspect to this is if V would 3-bet Kx preflop, hands like KQ, KJ, KT. If V would 3-bet these hands would he turn them into a bluff on the turn trying to rep an Ace?

this is a sick spot.

If V has been fairly active and shoving frequently post flop then I think we have to call here.

If V has been playing fairly snug post flop and hasn't been too active or shove happy then we puke fold here.

If V has been showing up with the goods when he is called, then we fold.

If we have no info on V, then I think this is a coinflip in terms of whether we call or fold.

To dgiharris

Am I missing something. When you say "Since this is a 4 handed table, raising from the BTN with Ax is fine".

The button is always the same, if it's folded to me in the button and I got Ax there is always 2 people left to act (assuming at least 3 people) so it doesn't matter if it's a 10 handed table or shorthanded right?

It basically is, minus some card removal effects. A8o is a really standard open on the button and a reasonably easy fold to a 3bet especially at lower stakes where people aren't 3betting anywhere near as much as they should.

There is a vast difference between being dealt an Ace at a 9 or 10 handed table vs being dealt an Ace at a 4-handed table.

I get that in both cases there are two people to act, but those situations are not equivalent. In the case of a 4-handed table, the aggression factor should go up when anyone is dealt an Ace or King. This leads to players assigning more value to an Ace or a King or a pair than at a table that started out 9 handed...


Meh, hate it when I potentially level myself when playing on a short handed table. Imo this is one of the mental balancing acts, making sure we understand when a player is properly adjusting to the shorter table vs players that don't adjust and play the same regardless of the table being 4-handed instead of 9-handed.

My post does assume a lot, it assumes we are playing vs villains that are adjusting to a 4-handed table and upping their aggression.

As is always the case, our response should be dependant on the type of villain we face.

I outlined my villain criteria in the other post so need to rehash...

Well yes I understand that theres a difference in aggression when it's shorthanded. What im not understanding is how that changes the value of the hand. If I got A8 on the button in FR when it's folded to me I will raise it and the usual nitty blinds will fold like 85% of the time. Same situation but the table is 4 handed, I raise A8 someone will probably play back at me if they adjusted. I will be put in more marginal spots as my opponents will use heavy aggression against me but my hand strength is still the same. The thing that changes is my opponents willingness to play back at me.


Or is this completely wrong?