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08-28-2014 , 04:14 AM
Im at my local casino with 200 bb, Ive been running good and in many hands preflop. The table is very loose calling preflop with most 12 dollar bets called by 4-5 people.
Im in bb with 67 off, preflop its limped and I complete. Flop comes 6 7 spades q clubs. I bet 15 and get called by 1. Turn is a 2 clubs and I bet 30 and get reraised to 80, villain has me covered and has been stagnant since ive gotten to the table. He was the deep stack before I took over.
What to do?
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08-28-2014 , 04:23 AM
If you're in the bb and it's a limped pot you check you don't complete. A sb putting in another sb would be completing. Could be wrong on that but if so someone will clear it up for me too.

You also talk in bb for preflop and $ in postflop, not very helpful.

You also give no information (that is useful really) about villain. Such as position, stack size, reads, etc

What hands do you think villain has? What hands don't you think villain can have given the action so far?
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08-28-2014 , 04:34 AM
Sorry about the complete thing, I checked my bb? The villain had around 500 dollars when I got on the table, he really hasnt done much while ive kinda run over the table. I made a couple hundred betting frequently without showdowns, lost most of it with aces vs jacks and made it back again being the agressor. After that he moved seats to # 1 a few hands ago, Im in seat 5 and he moved from my left? I dont know why hed move that way????
I had 400+ dollars at the start of the hand and he had a bit more. The villain is a 20s white guy, wearing a polo shirt and slacks, hasnt played many hands at all, this is the first action ive seen from him. Im putting villain on spades getting impatient when he reraised, or else he hit a set and im coolered.

Last edited by volcano41; 08-28-2014 at 04:50 AM.
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08-28-2014 , 05:01 AM
Can't tell much from your description of the action but if the guy has sat pretty tight for ages then you need to decide if hes capable of making a move or if hes just a nit who has it.
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08-28-2014 , 05:25 AM
From what I can tell you bet less than 1/2 pot on the turn. This has under-represented your hand which makes it difficult to read what vil is actually responding to. We hold both a 7 and 6 and there were no pre flop raises which massively reduces the chance of vil flopping a set. I can't see how the 2 changes much at all. Low live vils also like protecting their hand so on a flush and straight drawy flop I would have expected a flop raise with a very strong hand. I'm not expecting him to show up with a draw but it's very hard to work out what made hand he has.
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08-28-2014 , 05:40 AM
I did underbet, I usually keep it approx 2/3rd but spazzed.
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08-28-2014 , 06:08 AM
Call it.

I would like to raise it, but with not knowing much about villain I'm unsure if he will call the raise with Qx type hands. It could be possible that a small percent of the time he's trying to trap with a QQ+ hand, given how aggressive your image is.

Still, you only have to be good here about 30% of the time, his range imo looks something like {QQ+(small%), 66-77, 67, 8c9c, 8s9s, Qx, Q6, Q7}. You're blocking club outs {6c, 7c}, so I'll be check-calling river a lot, check-raise if I make a full house. I think a ten or queen would be a bad river card, so depending on the bet size I'd probably check-fold that.

I assumed this was $1/$2 with 4-5 people who limped btw

Last edited by NLBiddy; 08-28-2014 at 06:19 AM.
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08-28-2014 , 11:45 AM
What position is V in???

In general in this spot, bottom 2 should be good. Doubtful V limped QQ preflop and we block the 66/77 set making it unlikely.

Since the board is 6 7 Q it is likely V has KQ type hand that we are ahead of.

As far as the claim above that we under-repped our hand. I completely disagree. IN the live game, players don't think so much in terms of pot size, but rather in terms of how the current bet compares to the previous bet. You bet $15 on the flop and then double that on the turn so in the live game that is considered a decent bet. So villain is responding to your strength with strength.

Fortunately, most LLSNL villains will overvalue TPGK hands on FD boards not to mention they tend to overvalue TPGK anyways to begin with. i suspect V is most likely on a combo QX draw. He could also have Q6s or Q7s depending on his tendencies (your profile of V leaves a lot to be desired).

As played, call turn raise with the plan to Value bet all bricked rivers and c/f rivers depending on V's sizing and tells.
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08-28-2014 , 09:37 PM
I had put him on a likely spade draw, maybe im coolered vs a set. I just called the 80 instead of bloating things too bad before a spade hit or running headfirst into a set. The River came a low club and he led out 100, I called and he had a king 5 of clubs???
Another player questioned his 80 dollar bet on the turn and he said he had alot of outs??? Its pretty clear that if I had reraised allin id have taken it down on the turn.
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08-29-2014 , 12:09 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by volcano41
I had put him on a likely spade draw, maybe im coolered vs a set. I just called the 80 instead of bloating things too bad before a spade hit or running headfirst into a set. The River came a low club and he led out 100, I called and he had a king 5 of clubs???
Another player questioned his 80 dollar bet on the turn and he said he had alot of outs??? Its pretty clear that if I had reraised allin id have taken it down on the turn.
don't go broke in a limped pot

set is pretty unlikely here, unlucky OP. Raise turn or fold OTR.
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08-29-2014 , 01:06 AM
The most important part about this hand is how villain saw the turn. A lot of fish feel that when they have something like top pair they need to "make sure no more spades hit" before they bet. It's their version of pot control. Since this was a safe turn card for him he will probably severely over value a hand like KQo. I'd imagine he'd raise with a set to "protect his hand", and probably KQ spades for value even with his limited understanding of what a value bet is. I'd flat call and make it look like a draw then check river and expect him to bet again because fish always bet you off your draw at showdown
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08-29-2014 , 01:21 AM
Thats what I did, I check called the river thinking he missed his spades but it didnt work out. It was a bit of a shock that he was on a runner runner draw.

The whole table was in shock and alot of jibber jabber after that showdown, they probably put him on the made hand and me on the draw.

Last edited by volcano41; 08-29-2014 at 01:47 AM.
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08-29-2014 , 01:56 AM
Probably call and check/call most rivers IMO.
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08-29-2014 , 02:42 AM
I'm being results oriented, but V having two clubs makes a lot of sense for his turn raise. I imagine Qx would raise the flop because it's wet and it's unlikely V turned a set by calling your flop bet with 22

Prior to seeing results I probably would've played the hand the same way
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08-29-2014 , 03:06 AM
javi was right about how villain saw the turn- he saw his flush draw +king draw, And he probably thought I was full of it with all the action I had vs him sitting still folding the past few orbits. I was still good till the river so all I can do is hope to play against him again- and think through all my decisions.
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08-29-2014 , 05:26 AM
Quote:
Originally Posted by volcano41
The whole table was in shock and alot of jibber jabber after that showdown
Why?

Floating flop with an overcard and three to a straight and flush is nothing unusual?
Not sure about his reasoning for the turnbet, but because of your sizing he might think you have a lot of spade draws that are not ace high and a lot of straight draws in your range. The raise also helps to get you of 7x type hands on the river in case he misses.
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