hoping people can help...

say i am a canadian (or probably any G10 type country) citizen/resident....

i've come up with a great new widget. want to sell to large USA electrical supply companies. i've contacted a bunch of those companies, they are enthusiastic and i have appointments set up with the companies.

so i should up at US immigration at the airport and tell them, "oh yeah, i am going to USA for 2 weeks to meet with electrical supply companies to try to sell them on my products"

what will USA immigration say?.. "enjoy your stay" OR "you need a proper visa to 'work' in the USA" ?????

i've worked for larger companies and gone to conferences and made presentations to institutional investors at their offices in the USA... but 1) the presentation weren't so much a direct sell in those cases; 2) i was working for companies that had USA subsidiary and office (not that immigration ever asked... and they didn't ask if i was self-employed but it's a pretty popular question these days) 3) these trips were quite a long time ago (before 9/11 and homeland security etc.); 4) the selling trips were usually pretty short (1 or 2 days of business)

thx in advance!!

ok, it looks like under NAFTA as long as you don't lie/misrepresent to customs and if you have fixed date for leaving the USA you are ok.... i assume your fixed date can just be fixed in your mind....... and of course probably not too many days total (like the general 6 month test for residency)

Not an area I know well but I don't believe meetings count as working in the United States -- you're not setting up a loca office just having some meetings.

That said I don't think it matters so I would just say I was going on vacation. From my experience they don't really care what you say.

Much more important is concern over patents. If you show or discuss your idea with people outside your organization that could impair your ability to patent the widget after.

henry, thx... i think you are probably fine doing that...... but getting on the wrong side of USA immigration would be really really bad (ask stephen ames... hard to believe he did what they accused him of - saying he was US citizen, when it's so obvious and easy to check that he isn't)

Don't say vacation, the small chance of it completely ****ing you isn't worth it.

Say you're there for business. Meetings with people for sales/investment/exploring business opportunities is fine in most cases (research your specific case online, there's lots of info out there).

Don't say you're there for work. It's subtly different and can cause you problems if you get some ******* immigration guy.

Most importantly, answer every question honestly but in the most general way that still answers their question without volunteering extra info. Most of the time they just want to get you through quickly and don't care what you say.

This is what business visas are for. They hand them out almost as readily as tourist visas and are essentially the same thing - a short stay that isn't employment. Isn't this stock standard? Google B1/B2 visa and "visa waiver program"

Basically. Unless you hit the unlucky combination of an area that's kind of gray and get an agent that feels it's his national duty to stop anyone that might have even the smallest possibility of taking a job from an American citizen.

What are the odds that this would happen? I have to say we are talking several zeros after the decimal point percentages here. If he has a suitcase full of widgets and is flying that would be different but if I was driving across or flying to a major city with minor product materials -- 100% of the time I'd lie in this situation

This has generally been my experience. On my most recent crossing they knew I was lying because my story was ******ed and it didn't occur to me how stupid it sounded until I said it out loud. They still didn't care and let me proceed.

My last 4-5 crossings were all really sketchy (I wasn't actually doing anything bad but from a third party observer perspective it would look that way) and absolutely no issues. Years ago when I actually told the truth I had a lot of issues which is what motivated me to just start lying.

The odds are totally dependent on the person and in how that person responds to the common questions the immigration agent asks. I would guess for you the odds are that low. For someone nervous and not a common traveller they're much higher.

Where you're going and why is a common question. And if someone doesn't answer it clearly it's not that hard to get into a situation where they're forced to either lie more or admit that its really a business trip to follow up questions.

Getting caught lying can get you banned for years (and yes, it does happen) so its just not worth it when there's really no reason to.


This is totally dependent on who you get though. A ******ed story with the wrong officer will **** you. I got Nexus mostly because when I'm travelling what I'm doing is totally fine but I had a couple of incidents where the immigration officers I was talking to didn't actually know anything and sent me in for secondary inspection 'just to be safe'. Now I just avoid having to talk to a person - and everything is much better.

Edit: I will say the best way to avoid any hassles (besides avoiding to talking to people) is to figure out the exact right terms to use. OP look up the B1 visa definition and phrase what you're doing in the same language.

I think attitude has a lot to do with it too. My first few times through US immigration I was nervous (because Americans are nutter-level paranoid like no one on Earth, and have the opposite of common sense) and got questioned pretty intensely. Now I smile at the border guard and make a joke and I go through with rarely a question. Plus it makes their day better. Americans have a safe/dumb zone and a paranoid zone, if you stay in the safe zone, you can slip nearly anything by them.

Knowing the language they want you to use helps as well.

thanks for all the responses.....

is the b1 and b2 visa relevant to canada? we are greatly favored due to NAFTA. i am definitely interested as if you are successful small business person with main customers (and potential customers) in the USA i'd assume you'd be down there many many times. for example, i'd bet that canadian stock brokers covering USA institutional accounts might go down 20 to 25 times a year (most banks cover USA from USA but i think most boutiques cover USA from canada)

BUT crossing the border is still a big hassle, especially if you are driving. i notice they are much better at the airport (partially because i assume most people have return tickets

i agree that you do not want to get on their wrong side no matter how unlikely it is.

as i alluded to, almost never a problem at airport (canadians clear usa customs in canada). driving you get a major interrogation unless you are just going down shopping.

one thing to keep in mind is that starting very soon canada and usa will start sharing "leaving the country" info, which they haven't up to now. will have a big effect if the agent can see the info automatically and your trips don't match what you said (i assume they may have a button they push to classify your trip but maybe not)

meh, CBP are d**ks but I feel like England was the same as far as aggressive questioning goes.