The best part was aggo claiming bitcoin was saving people from dying in Venezuela, when pushed for receipts he kind of weaseled out of that discussion now we have people forgetting that just a few months ago Venezuela was arresting people for mining/confiscating their wallets.
Good job on staying attuned with reality guys.

You are being very optimistic given the way politics works in the United States. Kicking the can down the road is the current policy. I see it lasting a very long time. It’s almost equals death to a politician to do that. They rather overpromise, take on more debt, inflate away and think short term to just get elected and get re-elected.

Also given the demographics in the United States, the trump economy will problably not last too long before Democrats take over again and choke out growth again with climate change , over regulations, more welfare, bigger government policies, and higher taxes.

Allin, you realize countries with social democratic policies have outperformed the USA wrt GDP growth as of late? While not having massive inequality to boot?

Between "to the moon!" posts it is *possible* for you guys to make factual posts, right?

Your expert trades seem a little more like revisionist history. So you bought in May or June 2017 when cashgame players really started talking about crypto? Congratulations everyone who bought around this time made money. You were lucky enough to catch the meaty part of one of the biggest bull markets ever and not experience one major dip to make your weak hand fold. You then sold everything at 15k during the 1st big downtrend. Would you have sold if the downturn happens at 5k, what about 1.5k? Surely you would considering bitcoin is only worth $800. Let’s call it what it is and you were extremely fortunate to make money considering how ignorant you are on the subject.

There are people who sold just like you on the last major crash. They sold for 800 and 900 and never bought back in because it never crashed down to 100. Surely they are geniuses too and the hodlers are morons?

I will give you some credit for putting up real numbers to back your claim but spitting in the face of investors every time the market dips is childish and obnoxious, you aren’t going to be itt if bitcoin goes to 16k or 26k in June unless somehow you hit whatever magical reentry number your waiting for.

Full disclosure I sold a decent % of my holdings at 17k.

reality, something you are well grounded in https://cryptoinsider.21mil.com/exto...-mining-world/

Do you read articles before posting them or is the snark a deflection to post a terrible source that still confirms what I said while in no way refuting anything?

Your article literally says the government was going after miners, they were in danger and now have to register with the government.

That was the first link I've clicked on in a while on 2p2 that looked like a phishing scam though, so congrats on that.

Lmao.


I dont answer ****** questions that can be answered with a simple 2 minute google search. If you cannot accept or realize that bitcoin & bitcoin mining is providing a worthwhile escape for people who have access to it in those places in the world, theres nothing to discuss between us. nothing.

I don't post here mainly because I don't invest much (got some ten year bonds awhile back). Though I read the crypto threads because it has many lol posts. I've been on the side that bitcoin is a bubble for awhile. Though I don't get glee out of watching people lose money on it.

I don't believe the questions you ask to be of any real importance when judging bitcoin's actual value.

So let me ask you a question that I actually am curious and think about in terms of bitcoin. What is the inherit value of bitcoin that would lead it to be worth $20k or even six digits like some people claimed? I honestly don't see it until bitcoin becomes widely accepted and used by a larger population than it is currently. From the early days to now bitcoin seems to have attracted people who are chasing money.

Are you saying bitcoin attracts speculators?

Sure, but that's not what I'm trying to get at.

I wanna know what you guys think bitcoin's value actually is outside what speculation drives it to be.

Have you read the thread? It's been debated every single page for years.

You claimed it was literally saving lives. The only link posted itt said that middle to upper class Venezuelans were using it to enrich themselves, increasing the inequality gap in the nation while still being at risk of government raids and jail time for this activity until very recently, where they can now register with the government to perform this activity.

We both know you can't back up your words when called on it, it's ok to admit that you were using hyperbolic bull****. That's kind of standard itt.

bernie,

the only thing hyperbolic that i wrote was that they were mining btc. there are cpu bounded coins. gpu bound coins etc.

I legit dont think you've ever traveled the world and seen what it's like. There are places where when people die in the streets, they just let the bodies stay there for a while because there arent enough "police" around to pick up the homeless. Last time I saw this first hand was with beggars in china right before the olympics. When I asked the guide what they will do with these people before the tourists would come he told me

"dont worry, police will all take them away"

In some parts of the world there are only 2 choices people make... starve or not starve.

You're literally complaining about a social and economic construct which all humans live by, regardless of their choice. There's nothing bitcoin says about that or does about it.

If you are so concerned about rising wealth inequality around the world, try unplugging yourself and signing up with a self sustaining green community. Otherwise you can leave the crybaby stuff about people getting rich outside this thread. it has no relevance here.

Only for the past month or two and some light skimming previously. And the thread doesn't seem to answer the question I think about. I understand there's a cost of production from mining. So tacitly there is some $$$ amount they're worth from that.

Nakamoto institute, every video by Andreas Antonopoulos, relevant articles by Nick Szabo, recent St Louis fed publication is pretty good. Definitely not internet forums and social media.

You mostly need to DYOR especially before making an investment at this price point. If you do invest, try to befriend people much smarter than you who I found are mostly willing to help out so long as you make an effort to educate yourself before asking questions.

This dip is nothing. Should the bubble truly burst, then a 90%+ decline is in the offing.

Also, bubbles take time to correct. The dot.com parabolic mania took nearly three years to go from peak to trough.

Sadly this is true. Pretty much every major support level dating back to March is in play. I suspect the $3k carry-over limit on capital losses in the USA is having an impact too.

I am in the camp that bitcoin goes to 0 in the next 5 to 10 years, or at least crypto in the forms that we know it today. There is certainly some need for it, no doubt. But the governments of the world control and want to control more and more aspects of people's lives. Why would they allow such freedom to their people in perhaps the most important aspect - money.
For me, the parallels between crypto and, for example, online poker and p2p sharing are so obvious. While online poker and p2p sharing are still there, they are nowhere near the point where they once were, and both poker and torrenting are much more harmless. Once there were tons of poker sites, tons of torrent sites, a new one was coming to life every other day.. now there is 1 major one of each and it's a constant struggle to keep them on.
Where I am from, even now it's very hard to invest in crypto, because the local banks refuse to process crypto-related transactions. Some day crypto will just get banned, but it will be a slow and gradual death rather than an instant one - just like p2p and online poker. Considering who owns crypto - mostly young people, mostly men - I think the biggest concern for governments is not whether to ban crypto but how to do it without civil unrest. And you that by killing it off slowly - step by step, regulation by regulation, until it's pretty much dead or there is just 1 major player left (just like crypto and p2p), because you can control 1 coin, but you can't control 1000 coins.
tl;dr - I am 90% convinced bitcoin goes to 0, I am 99% convinced altcoins go to 0. The governments of the world don't what that anarchist bull****.

At least we can finally put the Tether nonsense to bed. Bitfinex has been the most resiliant exchange throughout this dump and steadily arbitraged to boot.

I have a degree in economics. I understand how things like stocks and bonds are valuated or if I have questions about specifics I have books and former professors' emails I can use. You throw me videos from biased sources. That's not how you try and ascertain info I'm looking for.

As someone alluded to above, we are not interested in rehashing topics that have been discussed 1000x in this thread, especially to someone who expects a detailed response without first providing his own analysis. If you want to read the most long-term bullish economic analysis ITT then search by author for Nooseknot.

So you admit that they can't actually stop it but they are going to ban it out of existence? You can't actually stop supply and demand. Look at torrents, communist govt, the drug war. Banning crypto would be bad economics and create an even more important use case for crypto. Look at the countries where crypto is banned, the price has actually gone up in some cases.

It will be hard to ban it completely, but what value will it hold if you cant convert btc to fiat and new people can't invest? I think it will be just like a poker site that bans withdrawals. Banning online poker was bad economics too... Not legalizing pot, prostitution, etc... is bad economics too.

How long did you check out his sources before calling them biased?

IMO andreas antonopoulos is one of the most unbiased sources that exists and frequently weighs the pros and cons of bitcoin. Check out his podcasts with Joe Rogan